If you had to vote today

Discussion in 'General' started by AWerner, Jul 5, 2007.

?

If you had to vote today for U.S. President, who would you pick?

  1. Biden, Joe

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. Clinton, Hillary

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Dodd, Chris

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Edwards, John

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Giuliani, Rudy

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. Huckabee, Mike

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. McCain, John

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. Obama, Barack

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  9. Paul, Ron

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. Romney, Mitt

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. Thompson, Fred

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  12. Other

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Gordana

    Gordana Well-Known Member

    DCMom's post was not angry. She was making a very good point. People should get informed and stop believing internet inuendo and rumours and then continuing to spread those rumours.

    Obama would be an excellent man for the job. Period.
     
  2. 4lilmonkeys

    4lilmonkeys Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(mar66rus2 @ Jul 7 2007, 02:25 PM) [snapback]321021[/snapback]
    No Child Left Behind - Bush. What a dump that is.....b/c standardize testing defines a child...yeah right. Also has to do with the amount of state funding a school gets....the worse your school does, the less you get.

    Gas prices which then has raised our grocery prices....he plays a part in it. Health care on the rise and benefits being decreased....pretty much nation wide. Jobs going overseas and to other countries....nationwide.

    April


    Uh, you do know that No Child Left Behind was written by Ted Kennedy, right? HIS idea. Bush handed over the reigns to him in his whole "let's reach across the aisle and be friends" BS back in 2002. Something his father also did. It worked out real well too. Ted Kennedy sure did return those friendly sentiments!

    You can also say a big thank you to your friendly environmentalists and OPEC for the increase in gas prices. We can't drill off of the coast of Florida and we can't tap our own natural rescources because we might hurt some sort of rabid bunny rabbit that lives in a hole in the ground. Did you know Texas has a massive natural gas reserve that reaches from the norther part of the state (north of Dallas) almost down to the coast? Did you know that nuclear power is THE cleanest form of energy, yet any time anyone proposes a new plant, everyone gets their panties in a wad and worries about radiation (which SO totally unecessary it's ridiculous). And, don't even get me started on exactly how much oil we *really* get from Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Venezuala. It ain't that much and it certainly debunks the whole "War for Oil" mantra the left has been spewing for years.

    Health care is on the rise because of the amount of illegal aliens invading our country daily (who get free care because hospitals can't turn them away) as well as an increase in malpractice/unmerited lawsuits. Companies cannot afford to give benefits anymore because of the cost. Especially small businesses.

    And finally, more jobs have been moved to the southern US than any of them that have gone overseas. Nissan just built one of the largest manufacturing plants ever in Mississippi. Why? Because it's cheap and they aren't being dragged down by unions who feel like it's a good idea to pay some guy $30/hour to screw a nut on a bolt. Toyota is looking to do the same. I'd take my business elsewhere too if I had to deal with all of the ridiculous regulations DEMOCRATS put in to place over the last 50 some-odd years.

    You want to talk about a quagmire? Let's compare the deaths in Vietnam to the deaths in Iraq. Let's talk about who REALLY screwed up the war, and NO it wasn't Nixon. There are definitely issues with Iraq, but to compare it to Vietnam in any way other than to say that there is too much politics involved, is not only ludicrious, it's offensive. We are fighting a completely different enemy. One that would rather cut off your head than let you walk down the street in jeans and a t-shirt. Do you REALLY think the international community loved us up until Bush took office? Please.

    All it takes is five minutes worth of reading to figure out that the President isn't at fault for everything that happens in this country. He actually has very little power over day to day dealings. If he DID, we would be calling this a dictatorship, though I'm sure there are those who already think that's what this country has turned into. My guess is that if you had to spend a few years as a scrub in Cuba, you'd change your mind.

    I'm not going to vote for a guy who's had ONE year in the senate. That's not enough time or experience IMHO. He may talk a good game and say all the right things, but so did Clinton. Yeah, that got us real far. I don't care if a person is LDS, had parents who were/are practicing Muslims, or used to pick their nose. All I care about is the security of this nation (which includes a lot of things) and that the person at the front of it doesn't cater to every whacked out dictator, group, or organization. That's all I want. Someone who knows what the H E double hockey sticks they're doing. Very few people fit into that category IMHO.

    OKAY...
    Hormonal lady OFF of her soapbox now.
     
  3. Mellizos

    Mellizos Well-Known Member

    QUOTE
    BTW: Obama spent 2 years at a Muslim school in Indonesia and there is some reports that Wahhabism was the curriculum there, which is a problem because they start with "We hate America" and work their way back from there.


    Indonesia is a Muslim country, so why is it shocking that he attended a Muslim school as a child? He wasn't even raised by his African father, who left when he was a toddler. His mother remarried an Indonesian man and the family lived there for a few years. Is he to be punished for the actions of his mother for taking him to a Muslim country as a minor child? The man has spent his entire professional life working for the underdogs and working class. But he's not "American" enough to be President?
    I guess I should stop associating with my good friends who met at a school in Jakarta while living there as teenagers. By that logic, I guess I should report the husband, who is a US diplomat, to security authorities so that he can be checked out for loyality to the US since he lived in Indonesia as a minor child.

    For all the "talk" of Obama's radical religious beliefs, how did he get a security clearance and access to classified briefings from the CIA. I agree with the PP, that unless someone presents evidence, not innuendo, it would be foolish to believe the information being spread about him.
     
  4. a1cbrandy

    a1cbrandy Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(4lilmonkeys @ Jul 7 2007, 03:11 PM) [snapback]321057[/snapback]
    Uh, you do know that No Child Left Behind was written by Ted Kennedy, right? HIS idea. Bush handed over the reigns to him in his whole "let's reach across the aisle and be friends" BS back in 2002. Something his father also did. It worked out real well too. Ted Kennedy sure did return those friendly sentiments!

    You can also say a big thank you to your friendly environmentalists and OPEC for the increase in gas prices. We can't drill off of the coast of Florida and we can't tap our own natural rescources because we might hurt some sort of rabid bunny rabbit that lives in a hole in the ground. Did you know Texas has a massive natural gas reserve that reaches from the norther part of the state (north of Dallas) almost down to the coast? Did you know that nuclear power is THE cleanest form of energy, yet any time anyone proposes a new plant, everyone gets their panties in a wad and worries about radiation (which SO totally unecessary it's ridiculous). And, don't even get me started on exactly how much oil we *really* get from Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Venezuala. It ain't that much and it certainly debunks the whole "War for Oil" mantra the left has been spewing for years.

    Health care is on the rise because of the amount of illegal aliens invading our country daily (who get free care because hospitals can't turn them away) as well as an increase in malpractice/unmerited lawsuits. Companies cannot afford to give benefits anymore because of the cost. Especially small businesses.

    And finally, more jobs have been moved to the southern US than any of them that have gone overseas. Nissan just built one of the largest manufacturing plants ever in Mississippi. Why? Because it's cheap and they aren't being dragged down by unions who feel like it's a good idea to pay some guy $30/hour to screw a nut on a bolt. Toyota is looking to do the same. I'd take my business elsewhere too if I had to deal with all of the ridiculous regulations DEMOCRATS put in to place over the last 50 some-odd years.

    You want to talk about a quagmire? Let's compare the deaths in Vietnam to the deaths in Iraq. Let's talk about who REALLY screwed up the war, and NO it wasn't Nixon. There are definitely issues with Iraq, but to compare it to Vietnam in any way other than to say that there is too much politics involved, is not only ludicrious, it's offensive. We are fighting a completely different enemy. One that would rather cut off your head than let you walk down the street in jeans and a t-shirt. Do you REALLY think the international community loved us up until Bush took office? Please.

    All it takes is five minutes worth of reading to figure out that the President isn't at fault for everything that happens in this country. He actually has very little power over day to day dealings. If he DID, we would be calling this a dictatorship, though I'm sure there are those who already think that's what this country has turned into. My guess is that if you had to spend a few years as a scrub in Cuba, you'd change your mind.

    I'm not going to vote for a guy who's had ONE year in the senate. That's not enough time or experience IMHO. He may talk a good game and say all the right things, but so did Clinton. Yeah, that got us real far. I don't care if a person is LDS, had parents who were/are practicing Muslims, or used to pick their nose. All I care about is the security of this nation (which includes a lot of things) and that the person at the front of it doesn't cater to every whacked out dictator, group, or organization. That's all I want. Someone who knows what the H E double hockey sticks they're doing. Very few people fit into that category IMHO.

    OKAY...
    Hormonal lady OFF of her soapbox now.



    VERY good post. Totally Awesome. Thank you.

    :a_smil09: :clapping: :banana:

    Brandy
     
  5. Trish_e

    Trish_e Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(4lilmonkeys @ Jul 7 2007, 04:11 PM) [snapback]321057[/snapback]
    Uh, you do know that No Child Left Behind was written by Ted Kennedy, right? HIS idea. Bush handed over the reigns to him in his whole "let's reach across the aisle and be friends" BS back in 2002. Something his father also did. It worked out real well too. Ted Kennedy sure did return those friendly sentiments!

    You can also say a big thank you to your friendly environmentalists and OPEC for the increase in gas prices. We can't drill off of the coast of Florida and we can't tap our own natural rescources because we might hurt some sort of rabid bunny rabbit that lives in a hole in the ground. Did you know Texas has a massive natural gas reserve that reaches from the norther part of the state (north of Dallas) almost down to the coast? Did you know that nuclear power is THE cleanest form of energy, yet any time anyone proposes a new plant, everyone gets their panties in a wad and worries about radiation (which SO totally unecessary it's ridiculous). And, don't even get me started on exactly how much oil we *really* get from Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Venezuala. It ain't that much and it certainly debunks the whole "War for Oil" mantra the left has been spewing for years.

    Health care is on the rise because of the amount of illegal aliens invading our country daily (who get free care because hospitals can't turn them away) as well as an increase in malpractice/unmerited lawsuits. Companies cannot afford to give benefits anymore because of the cost. Especially small businesses.

    And finally, more jobs have been moved to the southern US than any of them that have gone overseas. Nissan just built one of the largest manufacturing plants ever in Mississippi. Why? Because it's cheap and they aren't being dragged down by unions who feel like it's a good idea to pay some guy $30/hour to screw a nut on a bolt. Toyota is looking to do the same. I'd take my business elsewhere too if I had to deal with all of the ridiculous regulations DEMOCRATS put in to place over the last 50 some-odd years.

    You want to talk about a quagmire? Let's compare the deaths in Vietnam to the deaths in Iraq. Let's talk about who REALLY screwed up the war, and NO it wasn't Nixon. There are definitely issues with Iraq, but to compare it to Vietnam in any way other than to say that there is too much politics involved, is not only ludicrious, it's offensive. We are fighting a completely different enemy. One that would rather cut off your head than let you walk down the street in jeans and a t-shirt. Do you REALLY think the international community loved us up until Bush took office? Please.

    All it takes is five minutes worth of reading to figure out that the President isn't at fault for everything that happens in this country. He actually has very little power over day to day dealings. If he DID, we would be calling this a dictatorship, though I'm sure there are those who already think that's what this country has turned into. My guess is that if you had to spend a few years as a scrub in Cuba, you'd change your mind.

    I'm not going to vote for a guy who's had ONE year in the senate. That's not enough time or experience IMHO. He may talk a good game and say all the right things, but so did Clinton. Yeah, that got us real far. I don't care if a person is LDS, had parents who were/are practicing Muslims, or used to pick their nose. All I care about is the security of this nation (which includes a lot of things) and that the person at the front of it doesn't cater to every whacked out dictator, group, or organization. That's all I want. Someone who knows what the H E double hockey sticks they're doing. Very few people fit into that category IMHO.

    OKAY...
    Hormonal lady OFF of her soapbox now.


    :banana: WTG!!!!! Great post and nicely siad!!!!!
     
  6. AWerner

    AWerner Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(AWerner @ Jul 7 2007, 01:04 AM) [snapback]320347[/snapback]
    try www.freeme.tv

    you have to see the cartoon of the first debate :rotflmbo:



    http://www.ronpaulnation.com/tv.html#thereyougoagain

    here is the link to the cartoon of the Republican debate.
    I did not make the poll I just asked the question. Twinstuff made the poll.
     
  7. Monika

    Monika Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(Gordana @ Jul 7 2007, 03:00 PM) [snapback]321047[/snapback]
    Obama would be an excellent man for the job. Period.


    Each their own. :icon_biggrin:
     
  8. Trish_e

    Trish_e Well-Known Member

    QUOTE
    If anyone has PROOF that Obama is/was/would like to be a Muslim radical then TELLL THE FBI AND HOMELAND SECURITY! Oh, and don't forget about the Secret Service that is watching him 24-7. Please do not be naive enough to fall for this. The internet "news" about his "secret" of being an extremist Muslim started when he ran for the senate in 2004. Don't you think someone in the Pentagon would have at least checked before they let him go to Washington?

    Set an example for your children and THINK before you propagate ignorant, intolerant and racist views.

    And you can PM me if you want to debate this further - but I'm sure we all have more important things to do.



    Of course there's a chance that Obama is not be an extremist. It's the fact that he was raised by extremists that worries me; the beliefs were taught to him at a young age. That doesn't mean he carried his beliefs into adulthood, but do you think he would advertise it if he did? Do you think a man that is running for President of the United States of America would write a book stating that he is an extremist? Do you think he would tell a stranger off the street, a reporter, a friend, or colleagues? You don't know what's in his head because you are not him.

    You can call me rascist, you can call me naive, you can call me ignorant; but it is my belief that the American President should be raised in America, whether they are black, white, asian, hispanic, arabic, etc. Different countries have different beliefs. If you don't believe in the things Americans believe in, how can you run this country? And yes, Muslims have different beliefs. Whether or not they are raised to hate Americans, they do not believe in freedom of religion and they do not believe in equality between men and women, among other things. That is part of their system of beliefs and it goes against the constitution. It undermines what our country stands for, which is Freedom. Obama may be a great man; he may not believe in how he was raised; but I am not willing to take that chance. It's too big of a risk.
     
  9. mar66rus2

    mar66rus2 Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(4lilmonkeys @ Jul 7 2007, 08:11 PM) [snapback]321057[/snapback]
    Uh, you do know that No Child Left Behind was written by Ted Kennedy, right? HIS idea. Bush handed over the reigns to him in his whole "let's reach across the aisle and be friends" BS back in 2002. Something his father also did. It worked out real well too. Ted Kennedy sure did return those friendly sentiments!

    Uhhh....who signed the bill???? Oh yeah that is right....Bush did. So in the end....he put it into place.

    You can also say a big thank you to your friendly environmentalists and OPEC for the increase in gas prices. We can't drill off of the coast of Florida and we can't tap our own natural rescources because we might hurt some sort of rabid bunny rabbit that lives in a hole in the ground. Did you know Texas has a massive natural gas reserve that reaches from the norther part of the state (north of Dallas) almost down to the coast? Did you know that nuclear power is THE cleanest form of energy, yet any time anyone proposes a new plant, everyone gets their panties in a wad and worries about radiation (which SO totally unecessary it's ridiculous). And, don't even get me started on exactly how much oil we *really* get from Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Venezuala. It ain't that much and it certainly debunks the whole "War for Oil" mantra the left has been spewing for years.

    I agree that we don't get that much from other countries. DH and I get soooo irked when they use what is going on in other countries as an excuse for raising our gas prices. When a huricanne hits our oil rigs and shuts them down, then I can see them going up til things get settled.

    I am totally for Nuclear Power also. We live by two of them (about 30 miles away for one...15 for the other)....unfortunetly we don't get our power from them. One is up in Michigan and the other is out by Lake Erie (well both are by Lake Erie).

    Health care is on the rise because of the amount of illegal aliens invading our country daily (who get free care because hospitals can't turn them away) as well as an increase in malpractice/unmerited lawsuits. Companies cannot afford to give benefits anymore because of the cost. Especially small businesses.

    And yet they want to legalize those who are illegal....brilliant idea. Glad that is on hold for now.

    And finally, more jobs have been moved to the southern US than any of them that have gone overseas. Nissan just built one of the largest manufacturing plants ever in Mississippi. Why? Because it's cheap and they aren't being dragged down by unions who feel like it's a good idea to pay some guy $30/hour to screw a nut on a bolt. Toyota is looking to do the same. I'd take my business elsewhere too if I had to deal with all of the ridiculous regulations DEMOCRATS put in to place over the last 50 some-odd years.

    So screw us that live in the north....not all of us can move down south. Trust me....the thought has been there. I graduated from college with a degree in education (so I do have a clue on NCLB) a year ago. There are NO jobs here. Schools are cutting back and closing. Ohio isn't as bad as Michigan and I am on the border, but still no jobs. When we had our job fair, schools from Florida and S. Carolina were coming up to us wanting us to come down. If DH could re-locate job wise w/out losing his senority, we would be gone. Alot does go down south, but a lot also goes to Mexico or China (had an aunt training in China for a job that is done here, so who knows if that plant will close). Not all of us can up and move down south and shouldn't have to. Hopefully it will shift back north soon.



    You want to talk about a quagmire? Let's compare the deaths in Vietnam to the deaths in Iraq. Let's talk about who REALLY screwed up the war, and NO it wasn't Nixon. There are definitely issues with Iraq, but to compare it to Vietnam in any way other than to say that there is too much politics involved, is not only ludicrious, it's offensive. We are fighting a completely different enemy. One that would rather cut off your head than let you walk down the street in jeans and a t-shirt. Do you REALLY think the international community loved us up until Bush took office? Please.

    No, but they really hate us now!

    All it takes is five minutes worth of reading to figure out that the President isn't at fault for everything that happens in this country. He actually has very little power over day to day dealings. If he DID, we would be calling this a dictatorship, though I'm sure there are those who already think that's what this country has turned into. My guess is that if you had to spend a few years as a scrub in Cuba, you'd change your mind.

    No, our government is linked too....all go together though in the end. His ratings are down...way down...for a reason. Oh yeah, and what kind of impression does it make when Bush pardons Libby???? There is a good example set.

    I'm not going to vote for a guy who's had ONE year in the senate. That's not enough time or experience IMHO. He may talk a good game and say all the right things, but so did Clinton. Yeah, that got us real far. I don't care if a person is LDS, had parents who were/are practicing Muslims, or used to pick their nose. All I care about is the security of this nation (which includes a lot of things) and that the person at the front of it doesn't cater to every whacked out dictator, group, or organization. That's all I want. Someone who knows what the H E double hockey sticks they're doing. Very few people fit into that category IMHO.

    There are very few that can get the job done....bottom line....no one is going to like the all the plans of one canidate. Plus most of the time they are all talk and no show.....that goes for all of them.

    OKAY...
    Hormonal lady OFF of her soapbox now.


    My responses are in the quoted part....have to look for them.
     
  10. annelily2000

    annelily2000 Well-Known Member

    Even though I consider myself a conservative, I also consider myself a conservationalist. Thats why I would vote for Al Gore, but he says he is not running. We do need to think of alternate fuels so that the little bunny can have a home....My thinking is that God put that little bunny there and it's there for a reason. I don't know the exact reason, don't need to. God put the bunny there. I don't care where we get our oil from, I think it all needs to stay underground.
    I've read post that are concerned for our children and I think global warming is something to be taken into account for our children.
     
  11. Mellizos

    Mellizos Well-Known Member

    QUOTE
    It's the fact that he was raised by extremists that worries me; the beliefs were taught to him at a young age. That doesn't mean he carried his beliefs into adulthood, but do you think he would advertise it if he did?


    Obama was raised by his white mother and grandparents. His mother was married to an Indonesian for a short time during his childhood. His father had no hand in raising him. I fail to see any extremism in the mother, grandparents or stepfather.

    QUOTE
    You can call me rascist, you can call me naive, you can call me ignorant; but it is my belief that the American President should be raised in America, whether they are black, white, asian, hispanic, arabic, etc.

    Be very, very careful about this statement. My American children are being raised outside the US because my government, your government has sent me to work in foreign lands. They are no less American than your children. Also, thousands of American children of missionaries and businessmen live their lives overseas. By your standard, John McCain shouldn't be president because he spent a good portion of his childhood outside the US. Heck, McCain wasn't even born in the US. Neither was Mitt Romney's father (who was a presidential candidate in his own right). What about Bill Richardson who grew up in Mexico City? I think he is by far the most experienced foreign policy expert running in this election.
     
  12. Gordana

    Gordana Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(Trish_e @ Jul 7 2007, 04:58 PM) [snapback]321094[/snapback]
    Of course there's a chance that Obama is not be an extremist. It's the fact that he was raised by extremists that worries me; the beliefs were taught to him at a young age. That doesn't mean he carried his beliefs into adulthood, but do you think he would advertise it if he did? Do you think a man that is running for President of the United States of America would write a book stating that he is an extremist? Do you think he would tell a stranger off the street, a reporter, a friend, or colleagues? You don't know what's in his head because you are not him.

    You can call me rascist, you can call me naive, you can call me ignorant; but it is my belief that the American President should be raised in America, whether they are black, white, asian, hispanic, arabic, etc. Different countries have different beliefs. If you don't believe in the things Americans believe in, how can you run this country? And yes, Muslims have different beliefs. Whether or not they are raised to hate Americans, they do not believe in freedom of religion and they do not believe in equality between men and women, among other things. That is part of their system of beliefs and it goes against the constitution. It undermines what our country stands for, which is Freedom. Obama may be a great man; he may not believe in how he was raised; but I am not willing to take that chance. It's too big of a risk.


    Once again, you need to get your facts straight. Barack Obama calls himself Christian and is a member of the Church of Christ in Chicago.

    The man is intelligent, competent and is a good politician. He would make a great president regardless of his religion.
     
  13. twinstuff-old

    twinstuff-old Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(4lilmonkeys @ Jul 7 2007, 03:11 PM) [snapback]321057[/snapback]
    Uh, you do know that No Child Left Behind was written by Ted Kennedy, right? HIS idea. Bush handed over the reigns to him in his whole "let's reach across the aisle and be friends" BS back in 2002. Something his father also did. It worked out real well too. Ted Kennedy sure did return those friendly sentiments!

    You can also say a big thank you to your friendly environmentalists and OPEC for the increase in gas prices. We can't drill off of the coast of Florida and we can't tap our own natural rescources because we might hurt some sort of rabid bunny rabbit that lives in a hole in the ground. Did you know Texas has a massive natural gas reserve that reaches from the norther part of the state (north of Dallas) almost down to the coast? Did you know that nuclear power is THE cleanest form of energy, yet any time anyone proposes a new plant, everyone gets their panties in a wad and worries about radiation (which SO totally unecessary it's ridiculous). And, don't even get me started on exactly how much oil we *really* get from Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Venezuala. It ain't that much and it certainly debunks the whole "War for Oil" mantra the left has been spewing for years.

    Health care is on the rise because of the amount of illegal aliens invading our country daily (who get free care because hospitals can't turn them away) as well as an increase in malpractice/unmerited lawsuits. Companies cannot afford to give benefits anymore because of the cost. Especially small businesses.

    And finally, more jobs have been moved to the southern US than any of them that have gone overseas. Nissan just built one of the largest manufacturing plants ever in Mississippi. Why? Because it's cheap and they aren't being dragged down by unions who feel like it's a good idea to pay some guy $30/hour to screw a nut on a bolt. Toyota is looking to do the same. I'd take my business elsewhere too if I had to deal with all of the ridiculous regulations DEMOCRATS put in to place over the last 50 some-odd years.

    You want to talk about a quagmire? Let's compare the deaths in Vietnam to the deaths in Iraq. Let's talk about who REALLY screwed up the war, and NO it wasn't Nixon. There are definitely issues with Iraq, but to compare it to Vietnam in any way other than to say that there is too much politics involved, is not only ludicrious, it's offensive. We are fighting a completely different enemy. One that would rather cut off your head than let you walk down the street in jeans and a t-shirt. Do you REALLY think the international community loved us up until Bush took office? Please.

    All it takes is five minutes worth of reading to figure out that the President isn't at fault for everything that happens in this country. He actually has very little power over day to day dealings. If he DID, we would be calling this a dictatorship, though I'm sure there are those who already think that's what this country has turned into. My guess is that if you had to spend a few years as a scrub in Cuba, you'd change your mind.

    I'm not going to vote for a guy who's had ONE year in the senate. That's not enough time or experience IMHO. He may talk a good game and say all the right things, but so did Clinton. Yeah, that got us real far. I don't care if a person is LDS, had parents who were/are practicing Muslims, or used to pick their nose. All I care about is the security of this nation (which includes a lot of things) and that the person at the front of it doesn't cater to every whacked out dictator, group, or organization. That's all I want. Someone who knows what the H E double hockey sticks they're doing. Very few people fit into that category IMHO.

    OKAY...
    Hormonal lady OFF of her soapbox now.



    I appreciate your well-written post. It's always enjoyable reading original thoughts in political discussions and comments by those who take the time to research legitimate sources of information to support their beliefs.

    I do think there are a couple of responses I would offer to your comments, however. Not sure where the No Child Left Behind Bill got dragged into the discussion about who we might each vote for in 2008, but you're correct in that President Bush certainly did not author the act. Just like all bills, it was written by a Congressman. However, it wasn't solely "written by Ted Kennedy" either. He was one of four co-authors of the bill, two Democrats and two Republicans, a pair of Senators and a pair of Congressmen from each side of the aisle. It was a bipartisan effort that most agree has not gone as swimmingly as intended. And it's as unfair to blame Ted Kennedy for it as it is to blame President Bush for it.

    Also, Barack Obama has been a U.S. Senator for one term, but he's now in his third year as a Senator, not just one year (I guess technically you could say he's had 2 1/2 years in the U.S. Senate?) I agree he needs more experience though. But on the other hand, I'm not sure if I'm ready to vote yet for some of the candidates like John McCain or Joe Biden who probably have as much legislative experience as any candidate. You really have to go back to Nixon to find an elected U.S. President who had extensive experience in Washington as an elected official.

    I'm really not an Obama guy at this point and still am trying to figure out how I would answer this poll (probably between Clinton, Obama, Richardson, Romney, Huckabee or Rudy), but I've been defending him in this thread (and Hillary too) as I hate to see people eliminate candidates based on that candidate's race or gender. I'm not sure what "raised in America" means. Obama lived from age 6-10 in Indonesia; I don't think that disqualifies him from any elected position in the United States.

    No Child Left Behind information - http://www.house.gov/georgemiller/eseainfo.html
     
  14. Snittens

    Snittens Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(Trish_e @ Jul 7 2007, 04:58 PM) [snapback]321094[/snapback]
    Of course there's a chance that Obama is not be an extremist. It's the fact that he was raised by extremists that worries me; the beliefs were taught to him at a young age. That doesn't mean he carried his beliefs into adulthood, but do you think he would advertise it if he did? Do you think a man that is running for President of the United States of America would write a book stating that he is an extremist? Do you think he would tell a stranger off the street, a reporter, a friend, or colleagues? You don't know what's in his head because you are not him.

    You can call me rascist, you can call me naive, you can call me ignorant; but it is my belief that the American President should be raised in America, whether they are black, white, asian, hispanic, arabic, etc. Different countries have different beliefs. If you don't believe in the things Americans believe in, how can you run this country? And yes, Muslims have different beliefs. Whether or not they are raised to hate Americans, they do not believe in freedom of religion and they do not believe in equality between men and women, among other things. That is part of their system of beliefs and it goes against the constitution. It undermines what our country stands for, which is Freedom. Obama may be a great man; he may not believe in how he was raised; but I am not willing to take that chance. It's too big of a risk.


    Where in the heck do you get all this?? What if we were talking about a white person who was raised in Canada, Germany, or Australia, would you be saying the same thing? As far as I know, Obama was raised in the US and is a Christian. Just saw another post that he lived for four years in Indonesia. What does that have to do with anything?
     
  15. Snittens

    Snittens Well-Known Member

    To the topic at hand, I am leaning towards Bill Richardson or John Edwards. I think Richardson has the best resume and foreign relations experience, which is something this country desperately needs right now. I like John Edwards' personality, which I know is kind of a shallow reason, but he comes across as being very geniune to me. Some people don't like this about him, but I like that he was a trial lawyer and fought for people when they were wronged.
    I really haven't made up my mind yet.
     
  16. mar66rus2

    mar66rus2 Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(Snittens @ Jul 7 2007, 11:23 PM) [snapback]321182[/snapback]
    To the topic at hand, I am leaning towards Bill Richardson or John Edwards. I think Richardson has the best resume and foreign relations experience, which is something this country desperately needs right now. I like John Edwards' personality, which I know is kind of a shallow reason, but he comes across as being very geniune to me. Some people don't like this about him, but I like that he was a trial lawyer and fought for people when they were wronged.
    I really haven't made up my mind yet.



    This was the reason I voted for Edwards in the primaries in the 04 election. Then I was excited when Kerry took him in for VP. My MIL very much likes him too....she really gets into the political thing, but I haven't talked to her yet about all of this.

    April
     
  17. marieta

    marieta Well-Known Member

    I think it's reasonable for us to question Obama's beliefs and upbringing. Seeing what is going on in the UK certainly has me questioning.
     
  18. Trish_e

    Trish_e Well-Known Member

    Right now we have a Governor that was born and raised in Canada, she took office and has ran this state to the ground. :( We are at a all time low, people every where are packing up and moving. She is letting Canada bring their garbage here and dumping it. She is the worst thing this for our state and country. I'm sorry but I do not believe someone that was born and raised in Canada (or any other country) needs to be in office.

    As far as Obama I'm not comfortable having a president that has gone to a school that had a curriculum that starts off saying "We hate America". He may say hes a "Christian" but who to say that he won't take office and then decide to change his beliefs to what he grew up with. I'm not willing to take that risk. This is were I stand on the issue. I'm sure hes a nice guy but we can't let just any nice guy into office.
     
  19. Trish_e

    Trish_e Well-Known Member

    Please don't take me wrong, I'm not saying that I don't like people with different backgrounds. I just don't think they need to be holding political offices.
     
  20. twinstuff-old

    twinstuff-old Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(Trish_e @ Jul 8 2007, 06:36 AM) [snapback]321559[/snapback]
    Right now we have a Governor that was born and raised in Canada, she took office and has ran this state to the ground. :( We are at a all time low, people every where are packing up and moving. She is letting Canada bring their garbage here and dumping it. She is the worst thing this for our state and country. I'm sorry but I do not believe someone that was born and raised in Canada (or any other country) needs to be in office.


    I have no idea how good or bad of a Governor Jennifer Granholm has been for the state of Michigan, but I think again it's unfair to look at someone who lived four years of their life in a different country (Granholm was born in BC and moved to California with her family when she was four) and say that makes that person unfit to run a state or country. I really don't think she said to herself "I spent four years in Canada so I'm now okay with allowing them to dump their garbage in our state". And like I said, I really don't know what kind of job she's doing, but I don't blame her for the auto industry's woes which is really the only thing I can think of that might impact the rest of the United States and make her the worst thing for our country. Schwarzenegger spent a lot more time than that in Europe and most Californians probably think he's doing a job governing their state. He's not eligible to run for President (unlike John McCain who became a U.S. citizen at birth), but he would probably get a lot of votes for President if he was eligible and did run.

    I just think reading comments like that and seeing what happened at the Pan Am Games in Brazil this week (an American USOC worker scrawled the text 'Welcome to the Congo' on the pressroom blackboard implying that the country in the midst of their winter and with a daytime high of between upper 70s and low 80s is like the jungle. Nevermind that the Congo is in Africa. Brazilian newspapers jumped all over the incident and used it as an example of how some Americans just don't view other nations in a positive light) don't do justice to our global society. I guess your views echo a lot of Americans who also feel limiting immigration is important.

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion but just as our many international visitors enhance Twinstuff's message boards, so too do they offer a lot to leadership roles in many part of our society, in my views, including politics if someone who spent some time outside the U.S. chooses that occupation to pursue.
     
  21. Cristina

    Cristina Well-Known Member

    QUOTE
    You can call me rascist, you can call me naive, you can call me ignorant; but it is my belief that the American President should be raised in America, whether they are black, white, asian, hispanic, arabic, etc. Different countries have different beliefs. If you don't believe in the things Americans believe in, how can you run this country? And yes, Muslims have different beliefs. Whether or not they are raised to hate Americans, they do not believe in freedom of religion and they do not believe in equality between men and women, among other things. That is part of their system of beliefs and it goes against the constitution. It undermines what our country stands for, which is Freedom. Obama may be a great man; he may not believe in how he was raised; but I am not willing to take that chance. It's too big of a risk.


    Before I answer this, I will say that I am not a supporter of Barak Obama and will not be voting for him.

    Since we are now multi-ethnic country with diverse religions and beliefs, how in the world are you going to implement something like that? What do you mean when you say, "if you don't believe in the things Americans believe in?" Americans believe all sorts of different things. There are Muslim Americans, Christian Americans, Atheist Americans, etc... Part of our democratic process is to vote for the person we believe most closely represents us, and if they don't win, we just wait another four years and try again.. There are many presidents that have not believed what I believe, and they are as American as apple pie.

    As an American raised overseas, I am insulted by your opinion that I and thousands of others would not be fit to hold political office. Do you mean any political office? Not that it should make an ounce of difference, but I was raised by God fearing missionaries who decided to share their faith with others in other countries. While serving God in such a way, I was born. I was given US citizenship upon birth. However, I did spend the first 16 years of my life in another country. I have spent the last 20 here, raising my family, paying taxes, voting, attending school. Anyone that meets me is actually shocked when they find out I was not raised in the USA. I am sure ideologically many would approve of me. I would consider myself a conservative republican who tends to look at more traditionally conservative issues before I vote. And yes, I do vote. I am an American.
     
  22. sharongl

    sharongl Well-Known Member

    Thanks for that wonderful reply, Cristina!
     
  23. Mellizos

    Mellizos Well-Known Member

    QUOTE
    As far as Obama I'm not comfortable having a president that has gone to a school that had a curriculum that starts off saying "We hate America". He may say hes a "Christian" but who to say that he won't take office and then decide to change his beliefs to what he grew up with. I'm not willing to take that risk. This is were I stand on the issue. I'm sure hes a nice guy but we can't let just any nice guy into office.


    Ughhhh. Obama did not grow up Muslim. He was raised by his white, Christian mother and grandparents. He spent a few years AS A CHILD in Indonesia. A Muslim school does not equal curriculum that says "We/I hate America." Have you seen this curriculum from the 1970s? And I suspect that most schools have a Islam curriculum because Indonesia is quite simply Muslim. That's like being shocked that a child attended Catholis school in Ireland or Hebrew school in Israel. It's a non-issue.

    My children have spent their entire lives in Mexico and Ecuador, but that doesn't make them Catholic.
     
  24. Mellizos

    Mellizos Well-Known Member

    QUOTE
    As an American raised overseas, I am insulted by your opinion that I and thousands of others would not be fit to hold political office. Do you mean any political office? Not that it should make an ounce of difference, but I was raised by God fearing missionaries who decided to share their faith with others in other countries. While serving God in such a way, I was born. I was given US citizenship upon birth. However, I did spend the first 16 years of my life in another country. I have spent the last 20 here, raising my family, paying taxes, voting, attending school. Anyone that meets me is actually shocked when they find out I was not raised in the USA. I am sure ideologically many would approve of me. I would consider myself a conservative republican who tends to look at more traditionally conservative issues before I vote. And yes, I do vote. I am an American.


    :clapping: :bow2: :good:

    Thanks Christina!
    This is what I referred to earlier. I was born outside the US and have lived a good portion of my life overseas because MY government sent both my parents and me to work in foreign lands. It's insulting that someone would question my American-ness or that of my children because my parents and I chose a career path that entailed representing American to other countries. The fact that Obama spent 4 years overseas as a child means nothing to me except that he probably has a broader experience than some of the other candidates.
     
  25. marieta

    marieta Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(Cristina @ Jul 8 2007, 01:38 PM) [snapback]321625[/snapback]
    What do you mean when you say, "if you don't believe in the things Americans believe in?" Americans believe all sorts of different things. There are Muslim Americans, Christian Americans, Atheist Americans, etc... Part of our democratic process is to vote for the person we believe most closely represents us, and if they don't win, we just wait another four years and try again..


    That's just it. Perhaps she and others who feel this way, feel he "doesn't closely represent us" and it's ok for them to feel this. They have the right to vote for or not vote for someone if they feel they would not represent their views.
     
  26. a1cbrandy

    a1cbrandy Well-Known Member

    As an American..I do understand some of the fears being voiced in this thread about Obama. Its only normal to have these fears that "all Muslims" hate America. Look at the News channels...that is all people hear day in and day out. About terroist who are trying to kill us. I also understand that not every Muslim is against us..or hates us. There are some Athiest, Christians, Muslims, ect who also hate America. And there are all different kinds of people who love America.

    This is a great thread because we can all research the people who we do and do not know ..( I learned about Ron Paul here!!) and make our own decisions based on what we learn and read. This makes me want to learn more about Obama and his beliefs. I still will not be voting for him...or any other person who thinks abortion is OK...but i do want to know more about the man. :)

    Brandy
     
  27. Mellizos

    Mellizos Well-Known Member

    QUOTE
    That's just it. Perhaps she and others who feel this way, feel he "doesn't closely represent us" and it's ok for them to feel this. They have the right to vote for or not vote for someone if they feel they would not represent their views.


    I agree with this. I don't think Obama is what I'm looking for in a president. What I don't agree with is the spreading of untruths about someone, presidential candidate or not.
     
  28. Cristina

    Cristina Well-Known Member

    They absolutely have very right to vote for someone that they feel represents THEM. However, that doesn't mean that person represents all Americans, that person represents them. I also vote for the person I feel represents me. Making a blanket statement that the person must hold to what "Americans believe in" doesn't make any sense to me.

    I most certainly will not vote for Obama, because I feel his views on things are in line with my own. That is the beauty of the process.. Yet his views do represent other hard working Americans, who do not hold the same views I do... We are all different...
     
  29. Mellizos

    Mellizos Well-Known Member

    QUOTE
    As an American..I do understand some of the fears being voiced in this thread about Obama. Its only normal to have these fears that "all Muslims" hate America. Look at the News channels...that is all people hear day in and day out. About terroist who are trying to kill us. I also understand that not every Muslim is against us..or hates us. There are some Athiest, Christians, Muslims, ect who also hate America. And there are all different kinds of people who love America.


    Barack Obama is NOT Muslim

    Really, he isn't

    No radical Muslim education

    But I guess if Fox News says it, it must be true. :rolleyes:
     
  30. Gordana

    Gordana Well-Known Member

    Nicely said Cristina and Mellizos. :Clap:
     
  31. 4lilmonkeys

    4lilmonkeys Well-Known Member

    I think I understand the point Trish e was trying to make.

    I guess we could use the governor of California as an example. Remember the whole Nazi debacle before/shortly after he was elected? The debate was, could his father have passed on some of those beliefs, and if he did, is this really someone we want as an elected official. I think for some people, Obama falls into that category.

    Whether we want to believe it or not (and whether the media wants to continue to tiptoe around it or not), the people we are fighting ARE Muslim extremeists. And while we've all been practically beaten into tolerating and even accepting every type of lifestyle out there, the truth is...at some point we all have a decision to make as to how we feel about it. I guess it's a personal choice.

    Anyway, I think all she was saying is that she didn't want to take that chance. Even the OFF chance that somewhere along the way, Obama was exposed to those kinds of beliefs. The truth is we just don't know. And, that goes for anyone...maybe for others Romney falls into that category with his LDS beliefs. I *know* there are many, many people out there who think even Bush's Christian beliefs have come into play in his decision making.

    Maybe it's alarmist, but maybe for some people, it's just not a chance they're willing to take.
     
  32. 4lilmonkeys

    4lilmonkeys Well-Known Member

    Okay mar66rus2... :)
    I can't seem to get the quotes right, so just from what you've said, I'll do my best.

    -Yes, Bush signed and implemented NCLB. Was it a good idea? Probably not. I'm not a teacher, but I do have a child in public schools and I've not only spent time in his classroom, I've tutored his peers that were behind. I know and understand the frustration teachers feel. But, I wanted to point out that Ted Kennedy had a very large hand in writing that bill (I believe he'd tried to introduce something similar before?) and that it wasn't some sort of Bush brainchild. Hence the point that HE isn't entirely responsible.

    -And again, I understand your frustration with gas prices. I think we ALL know how hard it's hit our pocketbooks. Gosh, when I learned how to drive, I was paying $.89/gallon. I could dig under my car seat and find enough change to get half a tank. Violence and strife in other countries really do have something to do with how our price fluctuates. But, again, it's tied to OPEC and the fact that there isn't enough production/refineries here to balance it out.

    -I don't think I said this in my original post, but I do admit to having issues with the Bush administration when it comes to domestic policy. The immigration bill was a disaster and I couldn't believe someone, who had been the governor of Texas, would even TRY to get Americans to agree to that. If you don't live in a border state (or really even in the south), you cannot fully comprehend the drain that illegals are on our system. Texas has some of the highest health care premiums in the nation!

    -I didn't say that the north has to suffer. I was just pointing out the problems. The south seems to be more business friendly right now. Mostly because it's conservative and the unions aren't very strong in most parts. It's even more affordable to live down here. And while I agree that many jobs are going to Mexico and China, I feel the need to point out that this isn't new. I'd have to look it up, but while Bush has been in office, more jobs have been created (not sure how many) and our economy is actually very strong. This is despite the hit we took after 9/11.

    -I don't buy the whole "they hate us more now" argument. I think they've hated us all along. I think we have to really take into account how these people live. What do they see on TV every day...in some places (like North Korea) what are they even allowed to see? Whether we want to believe it or not, America is really one of the only TRULY free nations on this earth. We aren't jailed for looking up the word "democracy" on Google. On the other hand, if all I saw on TV were some of the reality shows they show here...I'd probably hate us too. :p

    -Bush did not pardon Libby. He commuted his sentence. Two different things. In his time in office, Bush has actually pardoned 13 (or is it 16?) people. Clinton pardoned 61. It's "tradition" for lack of a better term. I'd much rather see someone like Scooter Libby pardoned than some of the people Clinton let off the hook. It's important to really read up between the difference between state, local and federal governments. Yes, in general, they all work together, but not without a whole lot of red tape. Katrina is a really good example. The state and local governments refused to cover their behinds (even when Bush begged the governor of LA to declare a State of Emergency, which isn't his job). They relied on the federal government when it wasn't their job to cover disaster relief to that amount. In truth, the President's powers are very limited...and, there's a good reason for that.

    -I honestly think you and I are probably on the same page. There may be a few tiffs here and there, but in general I really do agree with you. I'm just personally really, really sick of the Bush bashing. It's been going on non-stop for almost 8 years and half of the things the left throws around aren't even accurate. I think that's what's so frustrating. If you want to dislike him, make a decent argument for it. I'm okay with that. I think, unfortunately, you might have just gotten the brunt of my hot-sports-opinion there. Sorry 'bout that. :)

    Anyway...back on topic!
     
  33. Tam1969

    Tam1969 Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(4lilmonkeys @ Jul 7 2007, 08:11 PM) [snapback]321057[/snapback]
    Uh, you do know that No Child Left Behind was written by Ted Kennedy, right? HIS idea. Bush handed over the reigns to him in his whole "let's reach across the aisle and be friends" BS back in 2002. Something his father also did. It worked out real well too. Ted Kennedy sure did return those friendly sentiments!

    You can also say a big thank you to your friendly environmentalists and OPEC for the increase in gas prices. We can't drill off of the coast of Florida and we can't tap our own natural rescources because we might hurt some sort of rabid bunny rabbit that lives in a hole in the ground. Did you know Texas has a massive natural gas reserve that reaches from the norther part of the state (north of Dallas) almost down to the coast? Did you know that nuclear power is THE cleanest form of energy, yet any time anyone proposes a new plant, everyone gets their panties in a wad and worries about radiation (which SO totally unecessary it's ridiculous). And, don't even get me started on exactly how much oil we *really* get from Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Venezuala. It ain't that much and it certainly debunks the whole "War for Oil" mantra the left has been spewing for years.

    Health care is on the rise because of the amount of illegal aliens invading our country daily (who get free care because hospitals can't turn them away) as well as an increase in malpractice/unmerited lawsuits. Companies cannot afford to give benefits anymore because of the cost. Especially small businesses.

    And finally, more jobs have been moved to the southern US than any of them that have gone overseas. Nissan just built one of the largest manufacturing plants ever in Mississippi. Why? Because it's cheap and they aren't being dragged down by unions who feel like it's a good idea to pay some guy $30/hour to screw a nut on a bolt. Toyota is looking to do the same. I'd take my business elsewhere too if I had to deal with all of the ridiculous regulations DEMOCRATS put in to place over the last 50 some-odd years.

    You want to talk about a quagmire? Let's compare the deaths in Vietnam to the deaths in Iraq. Let's talk about who REALLY screwed up the war, and NO it wasn't Nixon. There are definitely issues with Iraq, but to compare it to Vietnam in any way other than to say that there is too much politics involved, is not only ludicrious, it's offensive. We are fighting a completely different enemy. One that would rather cut off your head than let you walk down the street in jeans and a t-shirt. Do you REALLY think the international community loved us up until Bush took office? Please.

    All it takes is five minutes worth of reading to figure out that the President isn't at fault for everything that happens in this country. He actually has very little power over day to day dealings. If he DID, we would be calling this a dictatorship, though I'm sure there are those who already think that's what this country has turned into. My guess is that if you had to spend a few years as a scrub in Cuba, you'd change your mind.

    I'm not going to vote for a guy who's had ONE year in the senate. That's not enough time or experience IMHO. He may talk a good game and say all the right things, but so did Clinton. Yeah, that got us real far. I don't care if a person is LDS, had parents who were/are practicing Muslims, or used to pick their nose. All I care about is the security of this nation (which includes a lot of things) and that the person at the front of it doesn't cater to every whacked out dictator, group, or organization. That's all I want. Someone who knows what the H E double hockey sticks they're doing. Very few people fit into that category IMHO.

    OKAY...
    Hormonal lady OFF of her soapbox now.




    :bow2: Great post!
     
  34. mar66rus2

    mar66rus2 Well-Known Member

    QUOTE(Trish_e @ Jul 8 2007, 11:36 AM) [snapback]321559[/snapback]
    Right now we have a Governor that was born and raised in Canada, she took office and has ran this state to the ground. :( We are at a all time low, people every where are packing up and moving. She is letting Canada bring their garbage here and dumping it. She is the worst thing this for our state and country. I'm sorry but I do not believe someone that was born and raised in Canada (or any other country) needs to be in office..


    I live in Toledo, about a mile from state line. I grew up in Michigan. I did my student teaching in the school district I attended last year. Michigan schools are finacially in very bad shape. They had to close the school I student taught in and it was sad. They closed a Jr. High in the same county but different school district. They have gone so far down hill since I graduated (9yrs ago). They haven't had a good govener in a long time.

    April
     
  35. Snittens

    Snittens Well-Known Member

    Some of the things I am reading on here are downright ugly. FWIW, I went to a Southern Baptist school when I was a child and guess what? I am NOT a Southern Baptist and the vast majority of my beliefs are not in line with what most SB's believe.
     
Loading...
Similar Threads Forum Date
Today's Bible verse..for those who did not vote for Obama. General Nov 5, 2008
If you had to vote today..... General Sep 15, 2008
Your vote counts General Nov 3, 2012
Please vote for the sushi girls! The Toddler Years(1-3) Mar 21, 2012
*LAST DAY* VOTE for your favourite FY Halloween Costumes The First Year Nov 7, 2010

Share This Page