Bedtime?

My boys were 4 in December, so almost 4.5.  For those of you with kids around this age, what is their bedtime and wake up time on average?
 
We are having issues getting them to go to bed at night since the time change and it's light outside later, and then they are dragging in the mornings and grumpy and out of sorts.  I try to have them in bed by 8pm, and we get up around 6:45am.  Sometimes they take a short nap at daycare, but the teachers say they don't usually sleep much - it averages around 30 minutes, an hour tops (nap time/quiet time is 1.5 hours).
 
On weekends, I try to keep their bedtime the same, although it's more flexible if we are doing something, and they get up when they get up.  This morning, I was off, and they were still up at 6:45.  At 9:45pm tonight, they were still wide awake and playing around in their beds.  We don't do naps at home anymore because all they do is wrestle and play around and get into stuff.
 
I'm worried they aren't sleeping enough.  Most days, they are only sleeping 9-10 hours, and they are so grumpy in the mornings and fighting getting up that it's concerning.
 
We have blackout curtains and white noise in their room, and they have to share a room - we don't have a place for them to sleep separately.

 

My boys are a little over 5, but we have been in the same bedtime routine since they gave up naps around 4.  Mine are generally in bed sleeping between 8-8:30 pm and wake up on their own around 6:45 am.  We have the Goodnight Light, which is a nightlight that turns from a moon to a sun when it is OK to get out of bed, and it is set for 7:00 am so they get 15 or so minutes to wake up.  They also share a room with white noise and blackout shades.

 

When mine were 4-5...bedtime was around 8 and they got up anywhere between 6:30-7:30, it depended on the day.  They did not have naps.  Mine gave up naps somewhere around age 3.
Now they are 6 and we are lucky if they sleep past 7 on  weekends.  They are usually up weekdays at 6:45 for school. Bedtime is around 8-8:30

 

I wouldn't worry too much about number of hours but rather behavior - if they seem tired during the day then I'd look at adjusting your routine, but if they're fine I wouldn't worry about it.

 

 
They don't seem tired during the day (no yawning or saying they are tired) but they have been VERY whiny since this started, and extremely grumpy when I have to wake them on weekdays, so that's what make me feel they aren't getting enough sleep.
 
I'm not sure what I would adjust to our routine.  We do no TV or electronics an hour before bed .  They get a bath every other night, and they have a small bedtime snack, and then we read a few books before bed to help them wind down.  This has basically been our routine their whole life.

 

Mine are the same age as ours, I would say we dropped naps 6 months ago.  They are in bed between 7:30-8pm everynight and get up between 6-6:30 everyday.  I would say they average 11hrs of sleep a day at this point.  Some days I can tell they are tired and other days they seem fine, they are in separate rooms now for the last 9months and that seems to help with them going right to sleep at night.

 

My two never admit or complain about being tired but they become very grumpy and whiny.  Their behavior is clearly affected when they do not get enough sleep. I would never judge by yawning or telling me they are tired because that isn't going to happen. 
 
At 4.5 they were in bed with lights out no later than 6:30.  Sometimes closer to 6.  This has only recently moved to lights out between 6:30 and 7 and asleep between 7 and 7:30 but they are now just over 5 years old.  They both wake up between 6:30 am and 7:00 am.  Mine have not napped since they turned 2.

 

My girls also turned four in December. They're in bed at 7:30 every night (although, sleep time varies) and they're up at 6:15 during the week. On weekends they can stay up as late as 8:30 if we're doing something. They sleep until at least 7:30 on weekends and, if we call them to bed with us, have been known to sleep until 8:30/9:00.

They still nap anywhere from thirty minutes to two hours a day.

We are a family of sleepers, though. We all love to sleep and do it without complaint. I'm still trying to get nap time allowed at my office.

 

Mine just turned 5 in feb, and since school started last fall their bedtime is between 7:50-8:15 (ideally before 8 but that doesn't always happen), they are up at 6:45 for school during the week.  Weekends they are up anywhere from 6:45-7:30, and they usually stay up until 9pm.  No naps, mine gave them up around age 3.

 

Our twins will be 5 in June. They are usually asleep by 7.30 pm, but this can vary by about 30 minutes. They have to get up at 6.15 am during the week and mostly come on their own for snuggles at 6 am; I have found that if they have a hard time waking up that is my best indicator that bedtime needs to be a bit earlier for a couple of days at least.
 
On their long days at pre-school (3 days a week) they usually nap for at least an hour, but they gave up naps at home around Christmas, i.e. at age 4.5.

 

Thanks for all the input.  Sounds like our 8pm bedtime is realistic for the time they have to wake up.  I really don't know what else to change this point.  I don't think putting them to bed later is going to help matters any.