Vaccination video

http://www.mercola.com/2007/feb/15/shockin...es-for-good.htm

 

quote:
Perhaps it's not a great mystery why the Amish don't have autistic children ...

Electricity. It's the EM fields that the rest of us are around constantly that causes autism.

 

The video is the interesting thing to take note of, not the guys comments.

 

Here's some information about Dr. Mercola from Quackwatch. Also, the video is 90 minutes long, I just don't have that much time to spare. Like I said, I didn't watch the video, but there are instances of Autism in the Amish:
Genetic Link to Autism in Old Order Amish
Also 4kids4cat (one of our Heath Issues Mods) has done research into Autism here.

I thought I would put all of this out there so that we could get a balanced veiw on the issue of vaccinations.

 

Here is another video that I found really interesting. It isn't about the Amish, but it is about the link between thermisol and autism. The video is kinda long but well worth the time.


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6890106663412840646

 

But did you know?
....in July 1999 the Public Health Service (PHS) agencies, the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP), and vaccine manufacturers agreed that thimerosal should be reduced or eliminated in vaccines as a precautionary measure.

Since 2001, all vaccines given to children 6 and younger have been either thimerosal-free or contained only trace amounts of the preservative. Thimerosal has been phased out of some, but not all, adult vaccines as well.

Note - flu vaccine is an exception:
Today, all routinely recommended licensed pediatric vaccines that are currently being manufactured for the U.S. market, with the exception of influenza vaccine, contain no thimerosal or only trace amounts. Thimerosal preservative-free influenza vaccines are available, but in limited quantities.

 

Having "trace amounts" still isnt good enough. It needs to be removed 100% from all vaccines including flu vaccines. Besides it isnt only the thimersol that is harmful in vaccines. Formaldhyde (sp) and aluminum are also in vaccines not mention many other dangerous chemicals.

 

The PP made me curious, so I googled "formaldehyde in vaccines" and found this article from CHOP (CHOP is the chileren's hospital of Philadelphia).

What I found interesting is that the MOST that a child could get from a vaccine in .2 mg, and the amount normally found in an infants' system at 11 lb is 1.1 mg. Also, something I learned is that formaldehyde is essentian in the human metabolism, and required for the syntesis of DNA.

So actually the trace amounts of formaldehyde are really helpful, not harmful.

 

lindyloo, I appreciate you sharing Dr. M's video! Thanks!

 

I think it's a good idea to keep things in perspective --
Formaldehyde:
Found in shampoo, nail care, cosmetics, some toothpastes, and home construction materials such as carpet glue (do you let baby roam the floor?), plywood and particle boards.

Aluminum:
Found in antiperspirants, deodorants, some cosmetics, buffered aspirin, toothpastes, tooth whiteners, food storage containers, cookware, antacids, antiseptics, general purpose food additives, edible food coatings and food colorings.

Keep in mind, also, that many essential vitamins and minerals and other metabolites are toxic in large quantities (Sharon's post above a case in point). All things in moderation.

 

quote:
I think it's a good idea to keep things in perspective --
Formaldehyde:
Found in shampoo, nail care, cosmetics, some toothpastes, and home construction materials such as carpet glue (do you let baby roam the floor?), plywood and particle boards.

Aluminum:
Found in antiperspirants, deodorants, some cosmetics, buffered aspirin, toothpastes, tooth whiteners, food storage containers, cookware, antacids, antiseptics, general purpose food additives, edible food coatings and food colorings.

Keep in mind, also, that many essential vitamins and minerals and other metabolites are toxic in large quantities (Sharon's post above a case in point). All things in moderation.


Good point, Cathy, thank you for pointing that out.

 

Just b/c it exists in other products, doesnt mean that they are safe as well.

Here are some interesting reads

http://www.mercola.com/2006/apr/11/there_a...han_mercury.htm

http://www.know-vaccines.org/parent.html

http://www.gval.com/toxic.htm

http://www.vaccineinfo.net/immunization/vaccine_facts.shtml

http://www.mailman.hs.columbia.edu/news/th...sal-hornig.html

 

Angie,

Link 1 requires registration to read.

Link 2:
- "All vaccines contain toxic chemicals."
We've addressed this, to a point. Here's some information about why aluminum is used in vaccines: Aluminum

Sharon's link above addresses the formaldehyde question quite well.

- "DNA from animal tissue & aborted fetuses, and foreign proteins in the form of either live or dead viruses and bacteria."
The vaccines have to be made from something. Does anyone remember learning that the Smallpox vaccine was first made from cowpox, from cows??! Smallpox is certainly not the threat it once was -- it's practically eradicated from the planet. See this link: Smallpox
Edited to add -
Regarding aborted fetuses: The Rubella virus strain, RA 27/3, was obtained from an infected aborted fetus back in the '60's. For production, the virus is grown within a cell culture and is then purified from the medium for subsequent use as a vaccine. No vaccine alternative exists in the United States. In the UK, a Rubella vaccine made from chicken egg exists, but it is less reliable and is subject to serious side effects. See link.

- "Once inside the cells, the foreign DNA bonds to or replaces entire segments of your own DNA, after which the immune system no longer recognizes as "self." When healthy cells mutate into "non-self" cells, they become targets for the killer immune response."
This is plain wrong. The vaccine works by stimulating antibody production.

I'd really like to see some proof to all of the claims in this link. I am a scientist (molecular biologist), and I see sensationalism.... where are the scientific details and statistics to support these claims?

Link 3:
All three of these chemicals have been addressed (above).

Link 4:
More talk on aluminum and formaldehyde. I see a lot of discussion on "no long term studies"..... where is the data that shows there is a consistent proven problem with children's vaccines? And it seems to me that 100+ years vaccinations is a good long term study, in itself.

Link 5:
More on thimerosal. Even with "trace amounts" still in some vaccines..... the 'link' between thimerosol and autism has since been discredited anyway. Link.

.

 

Link 1- is free registration.

Link 2- I know why aluminum is in vaccines, that isnt the issue. Many people are against abortions, but it is okay as long as they are in vaccines and injected in our children??

Link 4- And in those 100 years, our people have suffered. When I was born 27 years ago, the autism rate was 1 in 10,000 and before that even more rare. Last year it was 1 in 166, this year it is 1 in 100. ADD/ADHD was unheard of, so was diabetes amoung children. Allergies were rare, the cancer rate has increased greatly in the last 100 years and now children are dying from cancer, not to mention many other ailments that effect both children and adults.

Here is a link where you can find studies on just about any vaccine.

http://thinktwice.com/studies.htm

Some interesting reads.

http://www.vaccinetruth.org/measles1.htm

http://www.whale.to/a/bystrianyk3.html

Link 5- that was a study performed which doesnt show that thimerosal is safe. It is a recent study that shows just the opposite. You said you wanted a study, there you go...

 

Not ALL States are using thimerosal free vacs. As of 2005 the state of IL was still using vacs with Thimerosal. The drug companies still use it, and will continue to make money on it until 2010. Don't you think it funny that the same companies that make Thimerosal also makes to drugs for ADD/ADHD?

 

Interesting thread. Cathy, lots of great points.

I just one question... angie7, do you get your children vaccinated? I am just wondering if since you are against them if you chose not to have your children vaccinated.

 

From Dr. Mercola's website:

"Learn More About The Great Bird Flu Hoax Now and Get Your Copy at the Very Special Low Price!"

Angie7 - This is who you recommend consulting when it comes to our children's health????

 

No, my children are not vaccinated. They've never had a single shot in their life, not even when they were first born.

The bird flu isnt as awful as the gov't wants you to believe it is. It is several countries, recently just popped up in Britian. It has killed less then 200 people worldwide and has been in contact with hundreds of thousands of people. If it was a true epidemic, more people would be dead or dying.

 

I don't want to get into a link-posting war.... for every point any person wants to make, there is a link on it, and then there will be a rebuttal link, too. That's the wonder of the internet. I could argue (and I believe this) that the rise in Autism and other disorders on the the PDD spectrum is due more to increased awareness of the Pervasive Developmental Disorders and better defined diagnostic procedures. Access to special education records is not as limited to researchers, as it once was, so more/hidden cases are being recorded. And before I start blaming vaccines for allergies, cancer, and diabetes, there are many many other environmental factors I will have to consider.

I've just been trying to present some thoughtful perspective here. If you choose to not vaccinate your kids, of course you have thought about it seriously and feel it is the best for you and your family. Your reasons to abstain may be due to the chemicals necessary to make/administer the vaccine safely and efficiently OR the icky nasty bug parts/DNA/proteins themselves (honestly, it is a gross thought injecting kids with this, unless you truly value the benefit); I just like to see all the points of view on the table, when a discussion like this is posted on the forum boards.

Kids not vaccinated today run a great chance of never getting one of the offending maladies, because of something called community immunity. Because vaccinated people have antibodies that neutralize a germ, they are much less likely to transmit that germ to other people. Thus, even people who have not been vaccinated often can be shielded, because vaccinated people around them are not getting sick. Community immunity is more effective as the percentage of people vaccinated increases.

 

This has been a great debate for many years and everyone has there own opinion on whats safe and whats not. Yes, vaccins have a lot of good aspects, but I don't feel that injecting our little babies are necessary. Babies brains are still growing and maturing until they are 2 yrs old. I don't see any proof or any good reason to inject a baby with vaccins.

 

I just want to offer a perspective: The was a small outbreak of whooping cough among un-vax kids in the school I teach in...AND in several neighboring districts. I am not willing to risk my children's lives with exposure to deadly childhood illnesses.

Cathy is right (although in animal science we called it 'herd immunity') un-vax people are protected by the vax ones! These disease are not gone, they are just under control....

 

Kellie, you reminded me. I once taught in a school where we had a student who wasn't vaccinated. He has Leukemia, and was in remission. Because he got Leukemia so young, he was unable to get vaccinated, beyond his first couple of shots since the leukemia compromised his immune system. He was only really safe because of the herd immunity of the people around him. If they had an outbreak like at your school, he would have not been allowed in school for his safety--and this was not a choice of his parents not to vaccinate. So by vaccinating, we also help those whose immune systems won't allow them to be vaccinated.

 

I wonder if all of the kids who don't get vaccinated are home schooled as our school system will not allow unvac. children to attend.

 

quote:
I wonder if all of the kids who don't get vaccinated are home schooled as our school system will not allow unvac. children to attend.


Unless it is a completely privately funded school, it has to let unvaccinated children attend. It is the law. There are variables by state, but no school can not let a child attend becuase he/she isnt vaccinated, it is discrimination. There are some hoops that the parents have to jump through, but there are ways. School districts just try and make you think that you HAVE to do something that is considered the norm and/or the safe thing to do.

 

Thanks for sharing the video... And to all of you who shared the links. I am on the no vaccination side of the fence, but I still appreciate everyones opinions and views. Its an interesting read.

 

Many of the outbreaks that occur in today's society are in vaccinated kids/people. For instance, in Iowa this past year there was a measles outbreak in vaccinated people. Just b/c one child is unvaccinated, everyone choses to believe that that one child started it, when in reality that just isnt the case everytime. Whooping cough happens in vaccinated children as well as many other diseases many get vaccinated for. When I was younger, I got chicken pox twice, after having been vaccinated for it.

If you actually take the time to research each individual vaccine, you will see that a decline was already taken place BEFORE the vaccine was invented. For instance, the measles vaccine was invented in the late 1960's, a 90% decrease in mortality had already been seen before the vaccine was ever admistered. Here is a quote
"Up to 90% of the total decline in the death rate of children between 1860-1965 because of whooping cough, scarlet fever, diptheria, and measles occured before the introduction of immunizations and antibiotics."---Dr Archie Kalokerinos, M.D.
http://www.whale.to/vaccines/decline1.html

Therefore "herd" immunity can not exist. These disease were on the downfall by tens of thousands, years before a vaccine was created thus, making "herd" immunity impossible.

Like someone else mentioned, any public school can not refuse an unvaccinated child. An unvaccinated child can get in to a private school IF that school receives any state funding (lunches, etc.) Every state offers a waiver. There are 3 total. Personal belief or philosophical, religious, or medical. A public school CAN NOT refuse your child and there is no vaccine that is manatory either by state or federal gov't. Everyone has the right to refuse vaccines, even the new HPV vaccine given to young girls to "prevent" HPV virus that causes cervical cancer. Below is a link that lists each state, what waivers are acceptable by which state and also lists state laws.

http://www.nvic.org/state-site/state-exemptions.htm

 

I personally choose to vaccinate, but I do have a friend that does not and to answer a question about public schooling not letting them in: she did have to get a religious waiver to have her child admitted. But that is how it is here, I cant speak for other states or counties for that matter.

 

quote:
Kellie, you reminded me. I once taught in a school where we had a student who wasn't vaccinated. He has Leukemia, and was in remission. Because he got Leukemia so young, he was unable to get vaccinated, beyond his first couple of shots since the leukemia compromised his immune system. He was only really safe because of the herd immunity of the people around him. If they had an outbreak like at your school, he would have not been allowed in school for his safety--and this was not a choice of his parents not to vaccinate. So by vaccinating, we also help those whose immune systems won't allow them to be vaccinated.



I have a good friend with a child with profoung CP. She is 7 years old, but will developmentally always be an infant. Due to many factors, they can not vaccinate her against a lot of things. It isn't their choice, their other kids are vaccinated. Anyway, she lives in fear over other children not being vaccinated and what they might expose her daughter too. I am not sure how it all works, I have not studied this at legnth. I do know living in Illinois, we opted out of the flu shot, but other than that, we vaccinate.

 

I do vaccinate my children and am grateful to have that option. One of my dear friends lost her daughter to pertussis, she was sadly too young to recieve the vaccination. You can read her story here Sabanna's story I would never want to see my children go through one of these diseases that can be prevented or the affects lessened. Its a very personal decision.

 

The Iowa incident mentioned by Angie was a Mumps outbreak, and according to this article, "Officials speculate that the epidemic might have been set off by someone from Britain, which has been experiencing a large mumps outbreak for several years...... The tens of thousands of cases in Britain have been blamed on problems with that country's vaccination program..... which left a significant proportion of the population unvaccinated." Also stated in the article, "Experts hope the relatively high U.S. vaccination rates will contain the outbreak." Angie, you say "herd" immunity cannot exist. I say this is a perfect example of how it CAN and DOES exist.

Whooping Cough -- Another article, Unvaccinated children help spread the disease (sorry, I said no link war, but this is important) -- "Before the original pertussis vaccine was introduced in 1949, the incidence of whooping cough was 150 cases per 100,000 Americans. The vaccine dropped it to 1.5 cases per 100,000, but it has been creeping back up since 1983, as more parents shun the vaccine for their children."

Finally, your (Angie) quote by Dr Archie Kalokerinos -- You failed to mention this quote, from the very same link you posted, "The decline in infectious diseases in developed countries had nothing to do with vaccinations, but with the decline in poverty and hunger. Of course that will have an effect! But I will add that on many of those graphs, I see a continued decline in disease, after the introduction of vaccines.... I think it's quite reasonable to consider that even though improved living conditions and advances in medical technology (in addition to the decline in poverty and hunger) play a significant role, vaccinations DO have an effect in the continued downward trend.

Just more "thoughtful perspective."

Cassie, thank you for linking your friend's story. My heart goes out to her and her family.

 

quote:
When I was younger, I got chicken pox twice, after having been vaccinated for it.


You must be very young. Since the vaccine was introduced in 1995, and only required in children starting school then, I remember because my neice was the first K grade to have to have it, and she is 15 now.

 

That is my point exactly.
Quote: "Officials speculate that the epidemic might have been set off by someone from Britain, which has been experiencing a large mumps outbreak for several years...... The tens of thousands of cases in Britain have been blamed on problems with that country's vaccination program..... which left a significant proportion of the population unvaccinated."

The US gov't ALWAYS try to blame something else other then US vaccinated citizens. No proof exists of this claim but they will not let the public believe that there is a problem with vaccines, that means they lose BILLIONS of $$ each year. Britian, and most other countries dont do the same vaccinations that we do, mostly b/c their gov't allows funds for long-term studies into the negatives of vaccines and therefore the gov't choses that most are not safe to give to their people. The US gov't does not allow any funds in the independant testing of vaccines, they would rather put people at risk, then lose money. The gov't does not test the long-term effects of vaccines. I am not just talking about if X vaccine protects against X disease (which they need to look further into) but if X vaccine and the dangerous chemicals in them cause autism, allergies, auto-immune diseases, cancer, diabetes, ADD/ADHD, etc, etc, etc. Countries like Britian which do perform long-term studies on health risks to vaccines realized that many are not safe and therefore do not poison their people just for a buck.

Quote:"Experts hope the relatively high U.S. vaccination rates will contain the outbreak." Angie, you say "herd" immunity cannot exist. I say this is a perfect example of how it CAN and DOES exist."

It cant exist. The diseases were already on huge downfall well before vaccines were given. Mostly do to better food and cleaner living areas. For "herd" immunity to exist, these diseases would have had to be killing thousands at the time vaccines were given, but they werent, showing that these diseases were going away on their own.

Quote:"Finally, your (Angie) quote by Dr Archie Kalokerinos -- You failed to mention this quote, from the very same link you posted, "The decline in infectious diseases in developed countries had nothing to do with vaccinations, but with the decline in poverty and hunger."

This just helps my case, vaccines did not help with getting rid of these diseases. Most US citizens are convinced through the gov't that vaccines stopped these diseases and without the vaccines they would come back and kill thousands, when in reality, vaccines had nothing to do with the demise of these diseases.

Actually the chicken pox vaccine was given in the mid to late 1980's, but it wasnt part of the "mandatory" vaccines like it is now. Not sure if it is the same strain given today, but they did exist back then.

 

quote:
Actually the vaccine was given in the mid to late 1980's, but it wasnt part of the "mandatory" vaccines like it is now. Not sure if it is the same strain given today, but they did exist back then.


Angie, I really think you have it confused, the vaccine didn't exist until 1995. I have done many google checks and can't find anything about a chicken pox vaccine before 1995. I am sure if it was available in the 1980's I would have had it, since I didn't get chicken pox until around 1989 when I was 21.

Also, people can still get chicken pox after having the vaccine, but the case is extremely mild, my friends son had a total of 5 blisters and no itching. Much better than the body covered in blisters and itching so bad I took 3 oatmeal baths a day.

 

Just came across this, with lots of good info on why the chicken pox vaccine is good chicken pox

 

My mom is a pedi nurse and I know for a fact that the chicken pox vaccine was not available til 1995. Its actually not mandatory either. My son's school did not expect us to have it for him, just the usual vaccines... and I remember I had to choose it for my DS in 2002.

Cassie, I just read your friend's story... it broke my heart. I truly am sorry for her loss.