tell me why I should keep them separated

PLEASE no bashing me over this topic. I'm emotionally high strung about it as it is...I will cry easily!

My girls are not adjusting well to being separated. One is having a much tougher time than the other (the opposite one I expected) and it's showing in her school work. When she's upset, she shuts down and rushes, and that's just what's happening.

They both tell me they love school, they love their teachers, they chat non stop about all the wonderful things about it. BUT...nearly everyday one is in tears because they don't understand why they "can't be with sissy".

In my heart, I keep hoping they'll adjust and this will get easier. But it's been 2 1/2 months. I was annoyed at first, always tell them matter of factly that this is just how it has to be. I do believe I'm doing all the right things at home to help them...but still the tears.

We have conferences today and I'm hoping to talk to the teachers about it. I just don't know what to do anymore. :gah:

 

Michelle, what was the reason you decided to separate? Just curious. Did the teachers suggest that or was that a personal decision? You know, sometimes situations change. In my opinion, even though it is hard, I really think you should finish this year out with them separated, then make the decision to put them back together for next year. I can not imagine how hard it is on you, because I know my girls would be doing the same thing. When we mentioned separated rooms Sarah had a come apart! So, we made the decision to keep them together until a teacher suggests separation, or until one of them decides that they want their own teacher. Hang in there, Momma :hug: They are halfway through the year! You can make it!

 

Michelle, I think it would only get harder as they get older. They will adjust. I only have the experience of my MIL who was an ID twin, who was "made" to dress like her sister, in the same classes, etc. She was also the dependent one. Long story short, her sister died of breast cancer before they turned 30. 40 years later, she still barely talks about her sister, she does more now due to my twins, but it is very difficult for her. The reason is that she had a whole identity attached to her sister, and still has trouble functioning in some ways without her. As a result she taught me from the beginning to foster and independence from each other.

Also, I spoke over the weekend to someone with 5 year old twins who are together, and she said how the fighting at home has escalated this year, and now she realizes it is because they are together 24-7.

I think some of your anxiety about it is also unintentionally rubbing off on them. They "know" you are uncomfortable with them being separated, so they are too.

 

I don't feel that mine argue anymore than normal, however, with that said, I often wonder how much better they might get along if they were separated. The big thing I see with them being together is the competition is sometimes off the charts. For example, when the teacher gives grades or testing results back, Sarah might say, "Did I do better than my sister" and that really bothers me and I know that bothers Allison, although she does it as well. I don't like that they compare themselves to each other academically, and it may be a big part of us deciding to separate later.

I do agree with Sharon that if they sense you are anxious that may contribute to them being more uncomfortable.

 

No advice, just :grouphug: .

 

I kept my girls together till this year (1st ). It's been the best thing we could do. They had become so competive and it wasn't fair to either to keep them together. I did prep them all summer to make sure they were ready.

 

I agree with Sharon on the points she made. At one point in life they will have to separate. Also you say that only one is having issues with it, so the other may miss her sister but she may be enjoying having her own thing. It wouldn't be fair, and this is only my opinion, to change everything around because one is unhappy. I'm sorry that one of them is feeling like this but hopefully they will turn the corner soon and learn to enjoy the time they have together in the afternoon. :hug: :hug: :hug:

 

I just don't see a right or wrong answer, Michelle. Every child is different, every twin set is different. I think you have to go with your gut. They are young - babies, really, in the scheme of life. I don't think it is going to hurt anything to let them be in the same class, if that is what will work better for them and you. :hug:

 

I agree with this.

I also agree that it will get harder as they get older...and as Liz mentioned at some point they are going to need to be separated.

I also agree that if it is only one of the girls that is having a tough time with it, is it really fair to other one to change things around? It's only been 2 1/2 months, that's really not a lot of time to base things on. And you don't want to possibly hurt the other girl since she is doing so well and adjusted so well to things by putting them back together. She may enjoy her own time and her own space...not to say she doesn't miss her sister as well, I'm sure she does. Have you talked to the counselor at school about this? If not, maybe it's time to get her involved. I'm sorry one of your girls is having a tough time with this. :hug:

 

I think if it has been going on since school started--- I would address it.

2.5 months is a short time in the *big* picture and may seem short to adults-- but to a young child that is a long long time. It has not improved then something needs to change if their are daily tears and anxiety over it.


My suggestion would to talk to the school counselor. That is what they are there for as a first line for school/home concerns. She may also be able to do some role play, talking, etc to help both of your DD feel more comfortable and one DD adjust.

The root of the problem may depend on what to do. Is she missing her sister because she is having trouble making new friends? Does she miss her sister because her sister was speaking out for her(or she was speaking for her sister?)? Does she just have separation anxiety over it? Does she also miss you/home? Is she struggling academically and it is manifesting as possibly her 'sister' would make it easier/better? Is the teacher/child match for one DD not a positive one- which could led to her wanting the comfort of her sister?

Do they see each other at lunch? recess? Does that help or make it worse?


I would also read books like "the Kissing Hand" and maybe allow a pic of sister on her desk (if that helps- some cases it may make it worse, you may need to test the waters!), or have one of those split in 1/2 necklaces and each girl wear one. Or have a positive ritual after school (like each sharing a special story or drawing a pic for sister).


I will say that mine are still together (2nd) and always have been due to different various situations (moving, one class availability, special needs placement, etc). Yes, we could have split them for 1st and 2nd (other years it was not an option). But for us and per teachers suggestion that either would be fine in our particular situation: we chose to keep them together this year.

Mine do not fight very often (they do fight, but not excessively or extensively) and play together constantly at home, but at school play with different things/people and both years teachers think they do just fine in a classroom setting together. They also are fraternal, dress differently, look very very different, and have different friend circles (with some overlap). We get some competitiveness, but since all the grade levels do the same tests at at the same time-- it would not matter, we would still get the " who got what score? Questions" Plus, in our case--- our girls move classes a bit for some academics. They are at the same level for both academic groupings (math & reading) so they would be together anyway for those times. Writing and spelling are individualized and science/social studies are group non-leveled. Neither speaks for the other in class and they have different temperments. The only class we have had trouble in is library! One DD tries to make sure the other DD checks out a book 'she' wants to read since they were allowed a book each. But since their book limit has been raised, this is no longer a problem!

That said: they have no trouble when one twin stays home sick, runs an errand with an adult, or has an appointment, etc. They always bring a treat/pic/etc for her sister-- but no tears or drama.

We have conferences in two weeks and I am asking what the 'plan' would be for next year. DH and I are OK with them being together (even though the school initially suggested splitting, but once we kept them together both the teacher and principal said afterward that in our case that either together or apart would have been OK)

 

I was in agreement with the school that my kids should be separated in 1st. I did ask them what they would do if we had a situation like what you're going through. They said that they wouldn't put them back together.

They gave a couple of reasons. Partly because it's not fair to the twin who's doing well on their own. Partly because they do need separated at some point. Partly because they don't want to give-in to demands of kids and letting the kids feel like they can make the decisions for the school. Partly because if they put them back together and try and separate the kids in a couple of years, some kids remember either very negative feelings about and get very worked up about it or they remember that if they complain long enough the school might give in again.

I agree that it's really time to pull the counselor in. I also think that maybe allowing them to eat lunch together or have recess together is a good thing. It's time to pull the teachers and the counselor in and deal with it as a team.

Marissa

 

I don't see any problem with them being together.
My girls go to a small school with only one classroom for each grade so they are together. They are not joined at the hip and they each have their own best friend now. (They are in 3rd grade now). Even among their cousins they each have their own bestie, so at family gatherings they run off in different directions.
I think moving one mid-year is probably a bigger issue than them being together. I think Sharon's MIL must be an extreme example and surely there are thousands of twins around the world in small elementary schools that do not have more than one classroom per grade level. I know my own elementary school was that way and it was in a different country than my girls.

If you end up not wanting to put them together, that might be the way to approach it. If they both love school and they both love their teachers than I bet neither one of them wants to be the one to give up their classroom.

 

I felt the same way as bolded above...2 1/2 months is a LONG time for this to be going on.

We do the kissing hand (LOVE that!) and they have made pictures for each other, so that has helped in the past.

I did address it at conference today. I wrote a letter to both teachers before the conferences and addressed my concerns. I was VERY impressed with their approach. The biggest thing my girls need, and have always needed with myself and with each other, is to "check in". Just a quick hug, kiss, hello, whatever...a 30 second checkin and they are back playing or doing whatever they were doing. I explained that in my letter and the teachers let me know that they're going to start having the girls deliver "notes" (they said they will be fake, but an excuse for each girl to leave the classroom) to the other class, so they can do a quick checkin with their sister. I was VERY happy that they were very receptive to my concerns. They also asked that I continue to report to the teachers to see if this is helping.

My gut is to keep them separated. I KNOW it's the right thing to do in order for them to grow individually. I just never ever thought it would be this hard or last this long.

 

Personal decision. I felt it needed to happen...because that's just what people do? ardon: I guess mainly for that reason but also because I saw one was frequently looking over the other one's shoulder and they did need to handle things on their own without always having the crutch of their sister there.

It was totally my decision. Their K teacher said I could go either way. She said they would be fine together, but can see a few reasons why I could separate them.

I think one of the biggest reasons...their school changed to K/1, next school is 2-6. I figured it might be a bumpy road for us so I felt it would be best to do it in this small, intimate environment where EVERYONE knows my girls (the only set of twins in their grade) so if some issue were to arise (like this) I just felt I would get better reception/more help. Does that make sense?

 

That was EXACTLY my thinking. They are only 6. If they were together this year or next, would that really matter against the next however many years of schooling. I'm deeply regretting my decision and wished I had waited until they were a bit older, mature, and able to reason with the decision a little better.

 

I think with ID's, it's a whole different ball game.

Definitely don't think my anxiety is rubbing off on them. I never discuss this in front of them and put on a completely different demeanor about it when they're around. I was TOTALLY fine with it, a little annoyed at all their crying about a month ago. I do give them a hug, tell them I'm sorry that they are sad, and leave it at that. It's when they're in bed or at school that I bring it up to family and friends.

 

Thank you ladies, so much. :hug: :hug: :hug:

 

I was going to suggest a "check in" time but I guess you got that figured out We separated Matthew and William this year in the hopes it would help their behavior at home by giving each other some space (we've never had an issue at school. Even though they are ID they go off and do their own thing). well...home is worse than ever. Not quite sure what to do about that but I digress. I hope the "check in" works for you all!

 

I have a different perspective on this since I homeschool. So all of my kids are together all day long and I am their teacher. Also I don't agree with the mainstream that says they need to be separated when they're young because its easier then. Sometimes, kids need their family. Sometimes the best option is to be together. However, in your case, I like what their teachers are going to put into place. That's so encouraging that they are willing to work with the girls needs! :good: I would wait and see if this improves the situation. If it does, then you can feel secure in that decision. If it doesn't, I'm confident the school will work with you. Then you can revisit the need to separate or not for the fall.

:hug:'s to you, Michelle. I know you are taking this so hard! Do you have a plan to reevaluate after Christmas? Or sooner? Or on a need to basis? You are a great mom. Just love on your girls, and know you can change things if you need to. :hug: s again.

 

We were urged very strongly by the principal and their prospective classroom teachers to separate ours for something similar to US pre-school - and we did against my gut feeling. One of mine is also struggeling with the separation. I requested a meeting with her classroom teachers about 2.5 months into the school year, like KCMichigan said I thought that was long enough into the school year for a child (mine are only 3). I am not too happy with the response from her teachers though, because they basically said that lots of kids need until Christmas to settle while I think 5 months of negative experiences, tears etc. is too much for a child.

I never asked before what would happen if we were to encounter a situation like yours and ours, but when I thought about it I came up with the same issues Marissa posted below:

Knowing our principal I am pretty sure she would also raise these issues and that the situation would have to be a lot worse before she would consider putting my LOs back together. The pre-school is small, so there is no school counselor or other "neutral" person to involve.

So, I have been working hard on not making the separation from her twin the issue but rather focussing on getting her to enjoy the pre-school experience as a whole and on helping her make friends in her classroom. For working toward a positive overall experience I have the support of at least one of her teachers, and I have talked to the moms of a few of the little girls in her class to help me encourage friendships.

I hope things work out well for your daughter and you get some help from the school!

 

I COMPLETELY agree with you. I hindsight, they are very young and I wished I waited.

They just asked me to check in with them (the teachers) from time to time. I'll give it about another month and see if anything is different. The girls were VERY happy to hear that their teachers said what they did.

The teachers also asked me to encourage the girls to speak up to the teachers if they are having a rough day and feel like they need their sister. I explained to the girls that the teachers don't know them like mommy does and won't know when they're upset or having a tough time so it's their job to talk to the teacher and ask to see their sister for a quick checkin or hug.

I agree, that is a long time for them to be upset. I wouldn't be too happy like that.

 

I agree with all the above.

Sometimes.....sometimes together is best and sometimes apart is best. I, too, think a blanket statement is misguided.

I did a lot of research on this topic. There were differing opinions from various well-educated people. But for the most part the professionals (psychologist, school social workers, etc) debunked the myth that all twins NEED to be separated to develop identity.

In some cases : Yes separation is called for ( high dependence on each other, inability to develop own identity/interests, not interacting with peers, vast academic or social differences,etc) and Yes, together is beneficial or neutral (evaluation was the same or higher as non-twin students) in some cases (twins going through high amount of changes and are not dependent on each other, situational such as teacher options and learning environments best suiting both twins).

I went to the principal armed with literature that supported DH and I choice. She was leery, but based on past suggestions of teachers the girls had, approved keeping them together.

DH and I reserve the right to split them/put them back together as needed throughout the years.

WOW!

5 months is 1/2 the school year. As a former preschool teacher there is NO WAY I would let a struggling kiddo take to Christmas to 'adjust' if there were tears, anxiety, etc. Often we gave kids with separation concerns and/or having trouble adjusting 6 weeks. At age3, 6 weeks is a very very very long time for a young child.

After 6 weeks: in preschool we would start to do interventions such as a shorter preschool day, a photo book, a routine calendar, a 1 on 1 with staff for positive interaction, a staff review if other concerns was worth looking at ( learning, physical, emotional, etc) and a reevaluation of teacher/child personality match.

Yes, sometimes it takes until Christmas for to 'stop testing limits' and feel familiar with the routine. BUT, after many discussions with other teachers we tossed around the idea that 6 month is a long time for a kiddo developmentally and why that transition from Sept to Jan seemed harder for some kids. This is what we informally came up with:

1.At the start of the school year is not the same child 6 months later! Of course attention, interest, skills, etc will be better--- they are older (and when young 6 months is big leap developmentwise).

2.Also, due to our calendar--- preschools/schools often start in Sept. Then BOOM-- we have Halloween, Thanksgiving, December holidays, etc. So as soon as you get 6-7 weeks in (average adjustment time) you get hit with holidays and short weeks, and changes in kids schedules, etc. and some kids dont handle routine changes as well.

3.Kiddos that dont handle change easily or take a long time to fit into new routines may have fits and starts of adjusting and never hit a good routine until Jan. Just a personality type: a set routine without big interruptions (days off school, holidays, family changes/stay up later due to holidays).

So yes, it may seem like kids dont settle until Jan. But honestly : It is more of a two wave.....school starts. Everyone fits into a pattern and learns the schedules. 6 weeks go by and then the routines get scrambled until Jan and Feb (which are long and quiet with few disruptions for holiday events/days off school schedule-wise--- households tend to have more open schedules/routines and it is just more relaxed in general)

This is likely more due to a combo of developmental growth, personality, and calendar events.

 

I don't see any problem with them being together either. Mine are definitely going to be in the same class from pre-k through 5th grade. (Assuming they get in to the school we want them to go to). There are only 2 classes and one is in French and the other Spanish. So we have no choice, unless we wanted them to learn two different languages.

If my two were having trouble being separated I think I'd wait for a convenient time and then put them together. After Xmas break if they'd let me, or for the next school year.

 

My boys will be 7 in December. This is their 4th year in school. They did 2 years of Pre k, kindergarten and now first grade. I have had them in separate classrooms since day one. Its a decision I made before they were even born. I wanted them to have their own identity, their own friends, I wanted them to be their own person. There are set of twin girls in my sons class and they get grouped together for everything bc the school does not want one to feel left out.. For instance, we do a student of the month. If one of the twins is selected for this award they both get it. When my kids are chosen its because they both earned it. My main reason for keeping them apart was this though. I didnt want there to be competition in the class room. If one of them was doing well and the other was not I did want want to try an explain to a 6 year old why he couldnt do something his brother did so by having them in different classes they can compare themselves to each other! They are both doing great in school, they both have their own strengths and weaknesses. They see each other at lunch and now they do have alot of the same friends bc they are not in first grade and the kids in their classes have changed.

Homework is a challenge because its different for both kids. It means double work for me but thats ok. I think its good for them to be apart but its a personal choice and one you have to make for yourself. Weigh your pros and cons and go from their

Good Luck!

 

Nikki, I think you did what you think was best and if your boys are very competitive then splitting them is absolutely what you would want to do at this age!






I just wanted everyone to know that sometimes discussions about strengths/weaknesses are a good thing if approached correctly.

I fully support parent choice of together or apart for twins based on each individual circumstance!! Everyone has to do what works for their twins in a moment in time, but also reserve the right to change it if the current situation is not working.

Some twins benefit from being apart, some benefit from being together and some it really would not matter either way. Circumstances also come into play-- like are there more than one class in that grade available, teacher teaching styles, etc.

Our school has had a couple of triplets go through. With only two of each grade, they would have to get split into groups of two and one. I am sure how they divide them each year varies by child, year, teachers, etc. There is also a set in our PreK program and they are all together.

 

Michelle, I am so glad that the teachers are working with you on this. I understand your reasons for separating them this year rather than next. The smaller environment is more comfortable for them. My kids were just separated this year. For them, I felt that the transition from 1/2 day to full should be conquered first and then the separation. They've done okay, although Meghan was having a hard time for a time about a month after school started. Keep us update on how they do with this new messenger role. Hopefully things will improve.

 

That has got to be the craziest thing I have ever heard. I agree with KC that is the school's fault for perpetuating such absurdity. I would absolutely hit the ceiling if my girls were ever treated in such a manner. Although my girls are together, they are always separated within the classroom. To my knowledge, they have never sat at the same table. Every conference we have ever been to the teachers are always telling us how they rarely play together on the playground and have their own friends. My girls most definitely have their own identity....they don't need to be separated to get that. It's a shame that people think that the only way twins can have their own identity is to be separated...I wholeheartedly disagree.

As mentioned by several posters already, you have to do what is in the best interest of your twins and your family. The decision to keep together or to separate is never an easy choice.

 

Why does everyone ASSUME you need to separate them??? I don't like it!! You don't! I'm not. There isn't a law. I don't see what the big deal is!! Keep them together if it makes them more comfortable.

 

Michelle, I really appreciate you sharing your experience with your girls. I forsee having this same issue with my twins. They like to do everything together. Their Pre-K is just one class, so they do have the same teachers right now. But I have been preparing them for kindergarten and telling them they will be in separate classes and neither one is really loving that idea. My reasons for wanting the kids separated is because mine are so reliant on each other, they would answer for one another, one would speak for the other, they would not interact with other kids, so for me it would be foster some independence but I know it's going to be very hard on them and hard for me.
I am glad that the teachers are working with you and your girls. I think the note idea is a great idea and I hope it helps out so that things are smoother for both girls. Keep us posted with how they do!

 

There have been several laws passed around the country to help parents have more rights concerning placement.

There are some good research papers and 'law data' at this site.

It encourages placement that is unique (together or apart) to each set of twins and to allow parental input on placement.


http://www.twinslaw.com/Welcome_to_Twinslaw.com_Where_the_twin_bond_is_celebrated_and_protected_under_law!.html

 

Thank you everyone for sharing your input and experience about this subject. My kids are only 2, and reading this is educational for me. I am not sure what our best choice would be for now, but reading this made me call our school and ask what their twins policy is - it seems that they go with the parents' choice - so it's nice that they don't force separation.

Good luck to your girls, Michelle, I hope the new strategy makes a difference.

 

It's only been day 2 but we've had no tears!! :yahoo:

Yesterday Em's teacher sent her to Lauren at lunch to say hi. They were so excited. I asked how it made them feel and both said "great!" and Em said "I had the best day!". Yes, I teared up!

I went in to the school this morning at dropoff and asked the secretary to report to the teachers that day 1 of operation Checkin worked well. :lol:

Today Em's teacher sent her to Lo's class to "get a book they needed". They said it was hard saying goodbye after that but they were very happy they got to see each other. :good:

 

I am glad to read that your girls are doing better!

As I had shared my experience above I also wanted to give an update.

We took a week off from pre-school to visit DH's family and things were much better when we returned, maybe they really needed a break to relax and start again without all the built up stress and anxiety. A bit like hitting the reset button on the computer.

Also, coming back from the break I decided to ask for some changes, very specific things I felt would help: I "borrowed" the idea from Michelle's thread and asked the teachers to give my little ones leave to visit their sibling during the part of the school day when they are separated and it seems to be helping a lot. I also asked to be allowed to drop them off together in one classroom (they have some free play time for the parents dropping off early due to work schedules before the actual more structured part of the program starts) and let one move to their classroom when the actual program starts. Settling into the pre-school day together also seems to help, as the clinginess at drop-off is a lot less and I leave happier faces.

 

My girls have no option but to be together. The only year they were seperated was 1st grade. I have to say with them together they lean too much on eachother. I feel they do not take the time to venture out on their own to become independant. I love the fact that they are close but I also want them to become their own person. I also think it is very important that they not be lumped into the same person. People look at them as "the twins" and not the 2 individual people which they are. Honestly I am looking forward to middle school when they are seperated.

 

Thanks for the input Chrissy. I separated for a lot of those reasons. Although mine are not ID, I find that since they are the only set of twins in their grade, they are often lumped together as one kid so I can see how it could be bothersome/.