First of all, you're funny . I promise I wasn't showing off...believe me, I'm dying to be in the NO night waking club. The saddest part is that I was a member from 3 months until 7.5 months! Oops, there I go showing off again. Anyway, what helped me the most was really filling them up during the day. Now there's no way I can be certain that that's WHY they started STTN, but I know it at least let me know that they were not at all hungry. So knowing that, I would just wake up and pat them in their crib as I put as much of my body in there as I could...quite painful, but they needed the cuddles more than the milk. So I'm sure you're wondering why I don't just do that now since it worked before. The answer...I'm lazy. It's just easier for me to bring them in bed because at least I get to lie down and fall asleep for a minute or 30 until the other baby wakes up. If they haven't cut out the night feeding by the time they're a year, I'll take a more proactive approach but right now I'm fine. I tried CIO and failed miserably. I don't think this was much help but I just thought I'd put it out there in case someone else would like to chime in with some great advice!
Thanks for the tips. I am trying to figure out how much solids vs. nursing I should be doing. We are so all over the board. I do need to find some consistency. I feed 3 solid meals a day now (just started a week ago) and so they nurse less during the day, not less often, just less passionately I got to thinking maybe I should be cutting back on solids so I did two meals for the last two days and those were the really bad nights so you could be on to something. I dream of sleep...I was actually reading some random blog the other day written by a guy who is attempting to convert to polyphasic sleep (I think that's what it's called) in essence he sleeps in short spurts around the clock rather than all night...ummm....why?
QUOTE(girls! @ Apr 10 2008, 09:50 AM) [snapback]715143[/snapback] I was actually reading some random blog the other day written by a guy who is attempting to convert to polyphasic sleep (I think that's what it's called) in essence he sleeps in short spurts around the clock rather than all night...ummm....why? :huh: And apparently he has nothing going on that he can sleep in spurts??!! If you want some help with sleep it may help if you post your typical day/night My advice would need to be taken with a grain of salt as mine did not STTN until 11 months when we did CIO
sorry, I wasn't meaning to show off either. I don't know that we had any secret - they just starting sleeping longer and longer on their own. Maybe coincidence, or maybe there's something to this - but when we started following the guidance in HSHHC for naps, and using his "method A" for putting them down - within a few days of doing his napping method, they started sleeping longer stretches at night. That's when the started going from 3 hour stretches of sleep, to more like 5 or 6. But that also was around 2 -3 months old, which is when a lot of babies start sleeping longer anyway I think. It seemed too good to be true at the time, and so I chalked it up to coincidence, but who knows. I agree with serannoboys too though - being sure that they'd had enough to eat during the day did give me the confidence to just comfort and not feed when they wake up in the night. And then maybe gradually they stop waking up, and/or putting themselves back sleep. There's that page on kellymom that talks about how much milk (how many calories?) a BF baby needs - that helped me a lot. As long as I felt like they were getting the calories they needed during the day, then I knew they didn't "need" to eat in the night - and that page helped me figure that out. We never really had to do CIO. I'm thankful for that. We sort of did it a couple times for naps, but never for very long and it was painful to listen to. good luck!
When we started putting our boys on their stomachs to sleep is when they started sttn. I don't know if you would be comfortable with it or not, but just thought I would throw that out there!
QUOTE(annelily2000 @ Apr 10 2008, 04:45 PM) [snapback]715243[/snapback] When we started putting our boys on their stomachs to sleep is when they started sttn. I don't know if you would be comfortable with it or not, but just thought I would throw that out there! Same with us. They've been on their bellies since about 10 weeks old. I forgot to mention that things started going a lot better for us when we followed HSHHC nap schedules as well! The STTN just sort of fell into place after that.
I think HSHHC is on to something when he says that some babies need night feeds until 9 mos. I think mine are those babies. Well, were. They aren't 9 mos yet ... but almost are ... and they are phasing out night feeds on their own. We did CIO to get them to GO to sleep at night and we did CIO for naps. Some nights they STILL cry themselves to sleep though no longer than a few minutes. HOWEVER, they do STTN more often than not these days and it is not anything I did. I think TEACHING them to self-soothe (by having them CIO) at an early age (6 mos) was what worked best for us. I have 5% babies, too ... so that is why I was OK still feeding them once at night. But now, Hannah almost ALWAYS STTN 7-7 and Meredith is about 50%. When she does wake, she eats and goes right back down. I think, a lot of times, at this age (except for things you can't do anything about like teething or developmental spurts) ... night waking is either from not napping well during the day and getting overtired or not being able to self soothe ... THOSE are the things I would focus on ... it may take some fussing but it will be TOTALLY worth it when all your hard work has come to fruition like ours has!!!!!!!!
QUOTE(excitedk @ Apr 10 2008, 11:13 AM) [snapback]715176[/snapback] :huh: And apparently he has nothing going on that he can sleep in spurts??!! If you want some help with sleep it may help if you post your typical day/night My advice would need to be taken with a grain of salt as mine did not STTN until 11 months when we did CIO our schedule is terrible. I spend my life trying to be on a consistent schedule. I've given up my social life and any freedom I had left to be a prisoner of our nap schedule. Here's the funny part...they don't freaking nap! They have 3 good days and then it's all bad again. Here was today's schedule (this is typical) After a night of getting up every hour...literally.... wake at 6:30 BF 7:00 7:45 snooze (not a nap but can't stay awake) 8:30 awake 9:00 BF then solids (oatmeal/bananas) 10:30 nap (never fell asleep) 11:30 rescue from crib after no-nap 11:45'ish nurse 12:30 solids (carrots/pears) 1:30 nap (never fell asleep...played/cried/yelled) 2:30 rescue from crib after no nap 2:30'ish nurse go for walk/play with older kids after school etc. 4:30 solids (squash, apples, peas) 5:00 nurse 6:00 bath/book 6:30 nurse and put to bed 6:40 sound asleep 7:45 awake screaming...no getting them back down...45 minutes of sleep and then wide awake...mess (we CIO here) 8:45 calm down a bit... 9:30 nurse (still haven't fallen asleep from waking after 45 minutes of sleep) sound alseep from here on out.... wake every hour from about 11:30 on...or every two ours on opposite shifts. I nurse them at least 3 times each at night so they get about 8-10 nursings in over each 24 hour period. I know our naps are the biggest problem but I don't know what to do. I could recite HSHHC word for word I've read it so many times. I have done method A for naps since 2 months...they cry the full hour. If they don't want to nap...they just plain will NOT nap. The only solution is selling our house and buying a 5 bedroom so they can each have their own and I can separate them. At least then maybe we'll find that one is ready for a good nap schedule. This nap issue is a major one. It's boring...you guys have bigger fish to fry, but thank you so much for brainstorming with me.
Wow I think our girls are somehow communicating 'this is how you make mommy crazy'! Our schedule is as crazy as yours! Naps have gotten a little better since I am only attempting 2 but nights are ridiculous! I keep thinking if they eat more during the day they'll sleep better but its not helping, I cant believe they arent fat! They still eat every 2hrs most of the day. :hug99:
QUOTE(cohlee @ Apr 11 2008, 09:42 AM) [snapback]716694[/snapback] Wow I think our girls are somehow communicating 'this is how you make mommy crazy'! Our schedule is as crazy as yours! Naps have gotten a little better since I am only attempting 2 but nights are ridiculous! I keep thinking if they eat more during the day they'll sleep better but its not helping, I cant believe they arent fat! They still eat every 2hrs most of the day. :hug99: Maybe we need an intervention...
Tell more about the nap CIO, did you try seperate rooms for naps (one in PNP and one in crib)? How many days did you do the 1hr rule?
QUOTE(girls! @ Apr 10 2008, 10:50 AM) [snapback]715143[/snapback] Thanks for the tips. I am trying to figure out how much solids vs. nursing I should be doing. I have been struggling with this too. At our 6 month visit this week (a little late) our doc said that we shouldn't worry about them nursing less because they will still take what they need which will be 24-32 oz. Not sure I understand that but it seems like if they only nurse "less" the feeding before a nap. I've been looking over tons of sample menus to try to figure out how much to give them (I hate wasting tons of food esp if it is made with breastmilk). Even those seem all over the place. I noticed that if I feed them solids until they stop eating (versus a set amount) they sleep better at night. It's only been a could days but even our horrible sleeper did a night with just one waking at midnight (our bedtime routine has them in bed at 7 the latest). The one thing I have got going for me is that we have naps down cold 90% of the time. Are you being super consistent with Method A? I notice if I change up things at all it is bad. What are you doing for soothing? Is one waking the other? Perhaps moving one would be good for a little while. Do they have a lovey? This helped DS a lot. QUOTE wake at 6:30 I assume they are waking up at this time right? QUOTE BF 7:00 7:45 snooze (not a nap but can't stay awake) 8:30 awake Do you have a AM routine? We do exactly the same thing every morning, if this is different it blows the AM nap. What would happen if you put them down at 7:15 or 7:30? Are they overtired by 7:45? QUOTE 12:30 solids (carrots/pears) 1:30 nap (never fell asleep...played/cried/yelled) Have you tried nursing before and after each nap? From your timeline sometimes they eat an hour before a nap. QUOTE 6:00 bath/book 6:30 nurse and put to bed 6:40 sound asleep 7:45 awake screaming...no getting them back down...45 minutes of sleep and then wide awake...mess (we CIO here) 8:45 calm down a bit... 9:30 nurse (still haven't fallen asleep from waking after 45 minutes of sleep) sound alseep from here on out.... wake every hour from about 11:30 on...or every two ours on opposite shifts. I nurse them at least 3 times each at night so they get about 8-10 nursings in over each 24 hour period. So you nighttime routine is similar to ours minus a bath. Have you tried switching to nurse then book. Personally I think it will make an easier transition to no bottle at night if nursing is not the absolute last thing they do before bed. We had this crazy up all the time thing going on for a while. It made me exhausted because there was zero down time. We had to let them cry. It was HORRIBLE and they cried (one and/or both) for an hour and a half. But then they slept and seemed much more rested in the AM. It took I think 4 or 5 nights to get to no crying. Our doctor says that they should be waking at least once a night and that if it is just once we are doing great (ours are little peanuts). But she also is careful to point out that if they are not doing a full nursing then we need to not go to them or it will just get harder. We have a 3 hours "rule" that is only broken if I am really tired and don't have the strength to listen to cries and/or they really do seem to be hungry. The rule didn't work good for about a month but the more consistent I was the better things seemed. Cross my fingers it's been really good for a couple weeks minus a few teething nights. Holy cow - I need to get out so that I can talk to adults....sorry so long. Can you tell I feel your pain!
I have to laugh. I just wrote about how great naps are for us and 30 minutes in DS is crying and DD is playing in her crib. Go figure! :lol: :lol:
QUOTE(girls! @ Apr 10 2008, 10:50 AM) [snapback]715143[/snapback] ...I was actually reading some random blog the other day written by a guy who is attempting to convert to polyphasic sleep (I think that's what it's called) in essence he sleeps in short spurts around the clock rather than all night...ummm....why? Sorry if this is completely irrelevant, but they did a Seinfeld on this. Kramer called "DaVinci sleep." If you need a laugh (or to distract yourself from crying babies) it was a pretty funny episode.
