Is this an insult?

I was speaking to someone the other day and said or twin pregnancy was "all natural and a big surprise!" She told me that the term natural was insulting to moms that had assistance with conception. I meant no harm and can't imagine the pain and difficulty involved in situations many people have to endure to become parents...but is it and insult to refer to my pregnancy as natural? If so what should I say? I was kind of shocked by her response and didn't ask her what she would prefer I called it.

 

Oops. See, I dont find it insulting .. but I never had to have help getting pregnant. I would hope this person understood that you meant no harm and it was an innocent statement.

 

Personally, I don't find it insulting at all....I've had soooooo many people ASK ME if the conception was natural, if we used fertility drugs and if it was planned...Should I be insulted??

 

I conceived mine through IVF and I have to admit that I find the "natural" comments to be a little insulting. I think my babies are every bit as natural as someone else's, even though we couldn't conceive them through more natural methods. Our babies are still products of nature and the twinning, in my opinion, is still a natural occurrence. The embryos still naturally implanted, we just needed help getting sperm to meet egg.

My babies could also be identical - from IVF. That's also a very natural occurrence.

When asked if my twins are natural, I say "yes, with some assistance from fertility treatments."

 

A lot of people here prefer the word "spontaneous" instead. The direct opposite of "natural" is "unnatural," and some people are sensitive to that connotation. The opposite of "spontaneous" is "planned," and most people who are undergoing treatment for IF are planning to have at least one baby. HTH!

 

its a common question; people are so curious if u used fertilely drugs to get twins--i have been asked numerous times if this was a planned pg too-i just say the same thing-yep it was planned-twins? nope that was the surprise yes i know my hands will be full with 4 kids thanks) --nope all natural no fert meds---its tthe same ones u can get mad but really people dont know it might be a insensitive thing to say; just because u have heard it for months now

 

QUOTE(rubyturquoise @ Apr 6 2008, 02:05 PM) [snapback]707721[/snapback]
A lot of people here prefer the word "spontaneous" instead. The direct opposite of "natural" is "unnatural," and some people are sensitive to that connotation. The opposite of "spontaneous" is "planned," and most people who are undergoing treatment for IF are planning to have at least one baby. HTH!



Very well said!

 

I have my identical twins via IVF. I find it "insulting" perhaps-- but more like NOSEY!

What difference does it make? That is kind of how I feel.. not insulted.. but WHY do people feel it is okay or normal to ask that?? Why??

I don't think it makes ANY difference (or shouldn't) and I think it is inappopriate to ask and I also think it's inappopriate to offer that up in your "explanation". Why is there an explanation anyway??

I am not really "insulted'.. I would feel the same if I had or had not done IVF I am sure. I just think it's a strange thing to ask because it doesn't matter. It is no one else's business if the stork brought them or what!! People get carried away with things and this is one of those things.. Not your business people!!

 

I think “spontaneous” is a fantastic way of saying it… and instead of getting into my birth control practices with strangers, I will say that from now on…

I think with my son being 10 and now I am pregnant again I get asked a lot what I did to finally conceive… and I just reply… nothing, I was actually on birth control when I found out I was pregnant with twins… now I get asked if they have the same Dad… so if it’s not one thing it’s another ardon: …

 

I think that "spontaneous" is probably the best way to say it.

 

I like "spontaneous". I do find "natural" insulting - it implies that my pregnancy/babies aren't natural. So, yes, spontaneous is much better!

 

Speaking to anyone other then another twin mom (except friends and family who already know).. I refuse to answer the question. I pretty much just say "why? Does it matter?".

I try to be careful about insulting people just because I know how harsh words can be. People are constantly insulting my family even though they don't always mean to. So I would agree..Spontaneous..would be better then Natural.

 

QUOTE(rubyturquoise @ Apr 6 2008, 10:05 AM) [snapback]707721[/snapback]
A lot of people here prefer the word "spontaneous" instead. The direct opposite of "natural" is "unnatural," and some people are sensitive to that connotation. The opposite of "spontaneous" is "planned," and most people who are undergoing treatment for IF are planning to have at least one baby. HTH!

Exactly.

So, I used fertility treatments so my kids are unnatural or not as good as if I were able to concieve on my own? That's what that statement implies, even if that's not what was intended.

TBH, I think the question, no matter how you phrase it, is nosey and rude. WHy is it anyone's business my reproductive history? You might as well ask me what position dh and I were in when we coonceived the babies. Do the conditions of conception change anything about the babies? THen why ask?

 

This is long, but I just have to wonder aloud about something I've noticed. I'm finding all the "politics" of multiples, particularly twins, to be interesting as it is something I'd never even given thought to before until we found out we were having twins. There seems to be this unspoken sort of sensitivity and even snobbery about certain "twin things". . . like some people really covet having identicals while others covet having fraternals, I've had at least two people I know who have had fertility treatments treat me as if I didn't deserve to have twins as mine are spontaneous and I already have other children, I've overheard or observed some parents of spontaneous twins being snooty towards someone who received help in conceiving multiples, and it's really all griping my behind TBH!

I don't volunteer to anyone whether any of my children were "planned", and I find it rudeit when someone asks that. I always want to reply, "Yes, God planned my children." I don't like it when someone asks, "Are you planning on having more children?" Because after having been on scary bedrest with my 2nd child, I don't take any of my pregnancies for granted - health may prevent me from having more.

I realize that not everyone is being malicious when they ask these things, but I'm with the others who find the question, "How did you conceive you twins?" to be nosey and rude.

And I can't even tell you all the cruel things some "friends" have said to me about the fact that I'm having mono/di identical boys. . . I've been told everything from "white baby boys fair worse than any other gender or race (wimpy white boy syndrome)" to people wanting to remind me (with an attitude of glee) about all the increased risks we face with our mono/di twins. And sadly, these comments have come from people I know who received fertility treatments or are in the process of it. Why can't we all be joyful about the birth of any child - whether "spontaneous" or conceived with the aid of science/medicine?

And I'm afraid sometimes that as parents of twins or multiples, we either attempt to elevate ourselves above singleton parents OR other people perceive us as being elevated. . .

Okay, sorry if I've hijacked this thread. Bottomline is that I don't like people asking me how I conceived my twins, BUT I am not insulted that you might've said you conceived them "naturally". I just don't think parents who had help with conception should be insulted. . . their babies are just as precious and miraculous. And they should be confident in that.

 

I have found that some people ask simply because they are having fertility problems and are looking for some positive responses. Many times people who have asked those types of questions ended up getting my Dr.s name from me. I was usually able to pinpoint those people, because they usually follow up the original question with more questions.

 

Honestly, I don't think it is something to be offended by. People are just curious and find "twin" information interesting. I have no problem offering information to them. They just don't the "correct" term to ask. I think we should be gracious to those that might not understand the "twinthology".

 

I don't think it is rude. She may have had some difficult experiences and just be very sensitive about it herself. I wouldn't feel too bad about it, you didn't do anything wrong. I had to use clomid to conceive these two, but I had two naturally before. It doesn't offend me or make me feel like less of a person because I needed help this time around. Maybe she does. I wouldn't get into what others want you to call it, you conceived naturally without assistance, you should feel good about that and just maybe say you're sorry if someone makes that big a deal about it and move on.

Jen

 

You found a very nice way to put it. People ask me that question all the time. I think that I will use your wording from now on as it sounds less insulting. :winking0009:

QUOTE(rubyturquoise @ Apr 6 2008, 02:05 PM) [snapback]707721[/snapback]
A lot of people here prefer the word "spontaneous" instead. The direct opposite of "natural" is "unnatural," and some people are sensitive to that connotation. The opposite of "spontaneous" is "planned," and most people who are undergoing treatment for IF are planning to have at least one baby. HTH!

 

QUOTE(HinSD @ Apr 6 2008, 03:55 PM) [snapback]707863[/snapback]
I like "spontaneous". I do find "natural" insulting - it implies that my pregnancy/babies aren't natural. So, yes, spontaneous is much better!

I agree, all babies are natural no matter how they are conceived.

 

when people ask I honestly think its none of there business the outcome is the same... babies to love... I didnt not need meds to get pregnant but I totally do not like it when the whole natural not natural thing is talked about

 

I haven't read all the replies but I CAN see how she would think it was insulting... but don't be set back too much by it. I mean, I find it insulting when people ASSUME I did IVF because for one, it is none of their business - and two, they've got some balls to ask in the first place.

Kind of like us all having twins.... people say things they don't realize we find offensive. They just don't get it because they don't have twins. Just like you really can't "get it" (nor could I) because we didn't have to have assistance. Well, I took one round of Femara.... but I really don't consider that "assistance."

(((HUGS)))

 

Oh, and one more thing...

The word "natural" in and of itself is quite ambiguous. When people ask my friend if hers are natural, she is always tempted to reply "No, they are spawns of the devil."

 

A co-worker of mine found out today that I am expecting twins (her eyes about popped out of her head because she didn't even know I am pregnant). She asked if twins run in my family and when I said "no" I could see that her next question was going to be along the lines of "fertility drugs" or something.

So I said: It is God's little surprise for us!

That seemed to satisfy her.

I don't know how I would feel in a situation where I had fertility drugs or IVF or something. Maybe "assisted" vs. "unassisted" would be less insulting? It's definitely a sensitive topic, no matter which side you are on.

 

I don't think that it matters how your twins were concieved! Be it "natural/spontenous" or if you had to use IVF. They are still your kids! Everyone is entitled to them no matter how you get them here. I have a T shirt that says "Expecting twins again" because I had twin girls last year (at 21 weeks so they didn't make it), but I always get asked if I had IVF and I don't find it insulting at all. People don't really know how else to ask it, ya know?

 

I wouldn't have ever thought about it if it wasn't for my friends on TS But now that I am aware for the pain it causes some, I try to go with spontaneous. Why not?

QUOTE(strongmommymolly @ Apr 8 2008, 12:10 AM) [snapback]710738[/snapback]
I don't think that it matters how your twins were concieved! Be it "natural/spontenous" or if you had to use IVF. They are still your kids! Everyone is entitled to them no matter how you get them here. I have a T shirt that says "Expecting twins again" because I had twin girls last year (at 21 weeks so they didn't make it), but I always get asked if I had IVF and I don't find it insulting at all. People don't really know how else to ask it, ya know?


Yes, but why must they ask that? They have a burning need to know how I conceived my kids? These same people are shocked when I ask them It's rude, insensitive and intrusive. This is not a subject I think is appropriate to casually ask someone. For the record, we didn't have help - but they don't know that this isn't a painful subject for me. (just irritating for me) If I did have a long difficult road to conceive my twins - why would they think I would want to discuss it with a stranger in the mall elevator? (I'm almost always asked in the mall elevator for some reason! :unknw: ) I know many on here that did IVF say they are glad to share with others they may help, and I think that is wonderful of them. But what about those that don't want to talk about it???

 

QUOTE(JediMom @ Apr 7 2008, 02:25 PM) [snapback]709516[/snapback]
I haven't read all the replies but I CAN see how she would think it was insulting... but don't be set back too much by it. I mean, I find it insulting when people ASSUME I did IVF because for one, it is none of their business - and two, they've got some balls to ask in the first place.

Kind of like us all having twins.... people say things they don't realize we find offensive. They just don't get it because they don't have twins. Just like you really can't "get it" (nor could I) because we didn't have to have assistance. Well, I took one round of Femara.... but I really don't consider that "assistance."

(((HUGS)))

Just what I was trying to say...only better!!

 

Why are people so sensitive about everything. What happened to good old communication and understanding, For goodness sake one can not say what is on your mind or lift you opinion about anything freely anymore, because Oh if you dare, you will be offending somone. What is it with everyone. Is the world and its people so self-absorbed that everyone think that every statement or opinion is about them. What happend to "if the shoe fits" and leave it there. Why can no one say anything anymore about their religion but can freely say what they want about politics. Ugh this is so annoying. Live and let live.

 

I have to agree with Boni.

I don't think you said anything untrue with your response. It's nothing to get all bent out of shape over like that lady did, IMO. You have nothing to hide, you just answered her question. I think SHE needs to get over it, personally. She's way too sensitive. It's not that big of deal. I had to have help conceiving my twins with clomid. I don't care if someone else says their twins were conceived naturally or with help. It doesn't matter, lol! It doesn't bug me at all, there are far worse things out there than this, and I think this is something an adult should be capable of handling without getting all bent out of shape. That's JMO, everyone out there has one and is entitled to it. If we let everything bother us, we would be wasting our time and energy over little things that don't even matter. EVERY child is from God, so it shouldn't be something to be so sensitive about, kwim?

I should add that I think the question of "natural vs assistance" is way too nosey of a question, and nobody's business.

 

QUOTE(Twins08 @ Apr 8 2008, 10:26 AM) [snapback]711080[/snapback]
I should add that I think the question of "natural vs assistance" is way too nosey of a question, and nobody's business.


I agree. I don't get particularly offended as I realize that 9 times out of 10 it is just curiousity. That being said, I don't think I owe anyone an explanation so when people seem to be fishing for info I keep things general. Ex. most commonly I get were you surprised, wink, wink or do twins run in your family. I answer yes to both, which although technically true, is most assuredly not how we got our twins I'm pretty certain the daily gonal-F injections did that.

Personally, I just chose to keep those things more private. Many in my family don't know. And, although it may have been an isolated incident, I once witnessed an unfortunate conversation where people were not terribly sympathetic to a woman who after having triplets via IVF was struggling saying things like, well, she knew what she was getting into and that's the risk she took.

 

When this topic was discussed on the general parent's club. I said I use the word unassisted. I agree that natural makes it sound like IVF twins are unnatural, like androids or something. But I was planning on having a baby and actively trying to get pregnant for several months---so I also don't like spontaneous. Personally, I'd be bothered by the implications that my pregnancy was unplanned. But I certainly didn't plan to have twins.

 

I personally don't like being asked how my babies were conceived at all. Seriously, would someone ask a person who was pregnant with a single baby that question? **** no. So just because you're having twins, what gives someone the right to ask how they were conceived - especially a total stranger? I had the supermarket checkout woman ask me that with a whole line of people behind me. HELLO!!! A little sensitivity and respect of privacy wouldn't go amiss. We did in fact use IVF, but that is nothing anyone needs to know unless we feel like sharing. It doesn't make our babies any less legitimate, or natural, or real. Thankfully I haven't had that question in a while, because next time, I'm going to give them a lovely description of kinky positions used, and then ask how their children were conceived, you know, to compare notes. That'll shut them up fast enough!!!

 

I don't find it insulting, but I did find it unnerving. My twins were conceived with IVF. I find it unnerving, only because I have had so many female issues, and pregnancy is for one, one of the oldest things WOMEN can do. Take that with all the other problems I have (PCOS) and it is like ripping every fiber of my being a woman away from me. To top it off my twins were born at 16 weeks, so that makes you even think well, ok the IVF worked, but I couldn't even do a simple task as to hold them in. And by all rights I should of been able to. But ever woman is different. Every man is different. In my eyes it is just kind of difficult, because I deal with other things on a daily basis of the PCOS.

Some people may find it rude, but no one knows their exact situation. Do they have the right to ask, **** no, but that doesn't stop them. Is it their business no, but they want to make it their business.

Babies are natural regardless. Science can not carry them for you, science can not grow them for you. Science can only help with the beginning. But your body is doing the rest, with the implantation, the growing, and the carrying. So therefor all babies are natural.