Going crazy with crying!

My 2 month old twins are driving me crazy!! They want to be held 24/7 and they will scream and throw fits and as soon as you pick them up, silence!! Then you can rock them to sleep or whatever, but give them 60 seconds after lying them down, they are screaming again.

What to do?? I get NOTHING done and DH and I are going crazy trying to figure out how in the world to get past this! Theres laundry to do, dishes, etc and they just wont let you do anything

 

Have you tried a Baby Bjorn?

 

:hug: Have you tried swaddling up tightly in miracle blankets and then placing them in their swings?

 

This is pretty much what I do. I swaddle them in their miracle blankets, pop in the pacifiers and put them in their vibrating seats. If one of the babies is still fussy then I bring him or her into the kitchen with me and let them sit there and watch me while I work. They eventually fall into at least a light sleep.

 

*Hugs* We went through this also. There was about a month where the babies would only nap if they were on me. Swings, bouncy chairs, swaddle, nothing worked! It drove me crazy worrying about cleaning, laundry ect. It was hard to even go to the bathroom! The only good thing was I lost all my baby weight because I could not get off the couch to eat. But the good news is this phase passed and now I have great sleepers. I look back on that time and I now wish I had not worried so much about cleaning and stuff.

 

yuck, that sounds like colic! are you breastfeeding or formula feeding? they make some formulas that are supposed to "cure" or "help" colicy babies, like similac alimentum or enfamil nutrimagen. we have tried both and they did help us a little.

here's what we did because our boys had(have) colic and cried consistently like that for a few weeks. a lot of people might disagree with this method because they are so young but we let them CIO in their cribs. we had no choice. we had to sleep/eat/do minimal household chores/have some sanity and it was just me, i am a SAHM with a husband who works 80+ hours a week! we would check the boys for dirty diapers, hunger, pain, etc. and if the cries weren't wailing to the point of hyperventilating, turning red, etc. we let them go. eventually they will cry themselves to sleep and they will learn (at least ours did) to soothe themselves and fall asleep without you having to hold them 24/7. it may seems cruel but with 2 kids and no one to help me i had no choice and wouldn't you know, it seems to be working and they are still happy little babies developing right on schedule.

it's really hard at first to let them cry because it does drive you crazy and it can literally go on for HOURS so if you have to go outside for a bit, take a shower, shut their door, do something to get away from the crying for a bit to clear your head. go outside and scream, or cry with them...i know i did.

otherwise get yourself a sling that holds twins (someone told me they make these) and carry them around with you all day.

i hope it gets better for you soon! hang in there, i know how terrible this is to deal with, trust me!

 

This is what worked wonders for my dd. It didn't stop all the crying but it helped give me a few minutes of no crying. :hug: You are in the thick of it, mama, and I know it's hard but it will pass and they'll outgrow the colicky (??) crying and you'll be able to have more time to do dishes/laundry/relax. :hug: :hug: Have you tried giving them gas drops? Do they like riding in the car? Maybe when your husband gets home he can take them out for a drive so you get a bit of time. :hug:

 

I third the swaddle & the swing and/or bouncer. I also did gas drops in their bottles...that helped out my DD a lot and using gripe water helped out my DS. You are in the thick of it, Momma, right now :hug:

 

That is extremely upsetting to me, and I hope no one takes that advice.

To the OP: I know how hard it is to have two babies that don't want to be put down for whatever reason. My twins had extreme reflux(to the point of refusing to eat), and some days I got absolutely nothing done because someone was always crying. It's physically and emotionally draining for sure. Just try and keep in mind that they will not be this way forever(even though it seems that way!). The roughest time for us was about 6 weeks, to 14 weeks, and things gradually got much better from there.

I agree with PP that mentioned white noise, swaddling, upright(in case of reflux---do they have reflux?), bouncies, swings, swaddled together, gas drops, and lots of cuddling, which it sounds like you are already doing. Hang in there, it will get better. :hug:

 

I cant even begin to say how wrong this is IMO. They are not self soothing themselves to sleep, they are passing out from exhaustion. Most experts dont recommend CIO until they are at least 6 months old and given their prematurity, maybe not by then. I am sorry, I do feel for you, but this post just makes me sad.

 

I definitely would not just let them cry for hours on end, day after day. If swaddling and swings don't work I'd try driving around in the car, if that doesn't work I would see about driving over to someone's house who can help! Even if it's just so that person can try to quiet the babies down so you can have a break.

If nothing is working then maybe you could have a friend or a neighbor come in and help you with the dishes and things around the house.

Have you seen The Happiest Baby on the Block DVD? I got that DVD as a gift soon after my girls were born and it was a life saver. It has a lot of very helpful suggestions for soothing fussy babies. You can get it on ebay for pretty cheap too.

 

Mine just turned 3 months and swaddling saved our cabooses. My daycare was not sure if they were swaddled and I almost considered switching centers because of that. Also, if they are tired, they won't sleep so they get fussier. At that age, mine never stayed up more than 1 hour at a time. Basically after their bottle, they stayed up for 1/2 an hour and then I swaddled them tight and put them down for a nap. Mine were easy and they slept in their crib but sometimes when they were fussy I would put them in a bouncer or swing. I would try putting them down for naps sooner for the day and see if the extra sleep helps them.

 

well it was what we had to do. i will clarify (so you don't think i'm even more of a bad parent) that their crying was a fuss cry. i KNOW when they are in pain, are hungry, need changing, etc. if they fuss and wimper there is no possible way for me to be with them 24/7 and still be sane. we HAD to do this. even if we did hold them they would still cry so putting them down in their cribs for a few minutes while i took a shower, stepped on the patio or went to the garage to change out laundry didn't make a difference. they would cry themselves to sleep on my stomach, in my arms, in their swings, it didn't matter. my babies just cried and one day it lasted for 6 straight hours but there was nothing we could do to soothe them.

i know they don't recommend CIO until much later on but it's really whatever works for you as parents. i'm not hurting my children, i'm not hindering their development, i'm not loving them any less. i did what i had to do to SURVIVE. yes it is painful to hear them cry and it makes you cry too but like i said, you do what you have to. if my kids need me, i'm right there but if they are fussing and mildly crying or not needing me right away they can wait a minute for me to clear my head, eat something or use the bathroom. it won't hurt them.

to tell a single mom who has multiples that she has to hold her crying child all the time is ridiculous. especially if that child is crying due to colic. you loose your mind doing that. forget about housework, that wasn't the issue but rest was and if mom doesn't rest or get properly taken care of then the children suffer.

i agree, try swings, swaddling, bouncy seats, baby einstein dvds, music, slings, anything you can think of but if you need a break TAKE IT...don't take it for long and always be in ear shot of your children but do take a moment for yourself, your kids won't die and you won't be a bad parent because of it! we tried all of these things and they didn't work, when we did CIO things just fell into place and it all stopped.

but don't think, that because we did CIO at 2 months, that i'm a bad parent or did something to hurt my children. they are thriving, extremely happy and are right on target with everything they need to be and i can't imagine my life without them. this was a phase that we went through and for us that's the only thing that worked. it's just extremely taboo.

 

This is exactly what I was going to say. It will get better, I promise. I know the light at the end of the tunnel seems very, very far away right now, but it is there & they will get better. Colic is one of the hardest things to get through in the first year. You will think you are going crazy, but try to keep in mind that your babies need you more than ever right now, they need to know that you are there for them whenever they cry. The time for CIO will come later, if you choose to do it, but they need to be older.

Someone on here said that taking the babies in the bathroom & turning the water on calmed her babies, some are calmed by car rides, I remember a mom I know turning on the washing machine & putting the babies carseat on top of it so it vibrated gently (don't leave them unattended there because of the possibility that they could vibrate right off of there), my husband used to push my daughter around & around the living room in her stroller, I had one baby who calmed down when I rocked him but it had to be very fast rocking, you just have to find that magic solution that works for you. If all else fails, just remember that they will outgrow it & this will all be a distant memory soon.

 

The PP jogged my memory. I realize it is cool outside but walks were a lifesaver for me. I would put the boys in the side by side, throw some blankets on top and walk them around. I still do this whenever I get a chance. The cool air seems to calm them and make them sleep.

 

I didnt say you were a bad parent. I just said that it makes me sad to think that your babies are CIO so young. And you are not a single parent. You have a husband, right? You can justify their "fuss cry" all you want. But your earlier post really says it all. If they arent hyperventilating or turning red you dont pick them up. I mean, I have been there. Two reflux babies, lots of crying, lots of spit up, up all night long, repeat, repeat, repeat. They didnt STTN until they were over 9 months old, and I was totally exhausted. But I would never be able to rest if my babies were screaming in the room next door.

 

Most of the time THIS iS HOW WE MADE IT through our days.
But we also used swaddling, white noise, pacifiers, bouncers, swings, a change of scenary!
My babies also liked the sound of the shower (so id put them in bouncers) or the sound of the vacuum.
:hug: hng in there and if you can have company that helps pass the time!!!

 

i am married yes. do i consider myself a single parent, yes. why? my husband works 24 hours a day every third day and then 10 hours a day on the other days. he gets ONE day a week where he's home for 24 hours, so yes i do everything on my own...therefor i am virtually a single parent. my husband offers very little support because he can't, we can't. our financial status won't allow any difference so this is how life has to be.

i hold my children, i love my children but when i need a break to clear my head so that i can be the best mom to them as i can i take it. babies make different cries for different things and once you can pick up on those types of cries you know what they need. what i was suggesting to the original poster was that if she needs to, to let them cry for a bit. if they don't need you, they are safe and aren't screaming their heads off then it OK to do that. i wasn't saying that i let my kids go on for hours or days of crying without me holding them or comforting them.

i'm glad that you found something that eventually worked for you and i'm sorry that it took so long and you were so exhausted. i too have the same problems. two severe reflux babies and have spent many a night up with them and spent the first 2 1/2 months of their lives living on no sleep and no energy. i'm glad that you were able to function but for many of us that doesn't work. if i don't get sleep i get stressed out, when i get stressed out i don't eat, when i don't eat i don't have energy, when i don't have energy i don't have motivation, when all of these factors hit at once my blood pressure drops dramatically when i stand up and i pass out, literally to the floor. so i HAD to sleep on some kind of schedule in order to function so that i could and can take care of my kids. if that meant they cried a little so i could sleep so be it, the alternative was far worse.

basically i'm giving this poor mom another option. when all else fails this IS worth a try. if it doesn't work it doesn't work. for me it did. but i didn't and don't have the luxury of someone to help me out, i can't afford a night nurse, daycare, etc.

 

That's exactly what you said.

I can't either.

While I agree that if you are at your limit, you need to put them down and walk away for a a bit, the advice you gave in your first post, was not suggesting that at all. It was suggesting that you let a baby 2-3 months old CIO, which IMO, is not 'another option' for that age.

 

different stokes for different folks i suppose.

and when i said that the crying can go on for hours and that you should step outside i did not say you should say you should also leave for hours. i did not specify how long you should take your break. sorry that i didn't clarify that.

to the original poster, best of luck to you and i hope you get through this soon! my heart goes out to you!

 

That was me, and for our babies that worked 95% of the time. We would swaddle the fussy baby up tight, sit them in their reclined infant-to-toddler rocker in the dark bathroom (only a nightlight) and turn on the tub water. Usually within minutes the crying would cease and shortly after that they would be asleep. Different things work for different people though. I recommend taking a big glass of wine with you and enjoying a bath during that time, if it works for them

Wow, you are the Moby Wrap Queen!! I was just extolling the virtues of a moby wrap on this forum the other day. And just today I went back to JoAnn Fabrics to buy more fabric so that my husband can have his own homemade Moby Wrap. Our boys are currently 14 lbs each, so hopefully we'll get a lot more use out of the moby wraps before I have to part with them! And hopefully I can learn some more positions for our babies too, so they don't get board with the standard position where they face my chest.

 

Nah, because that would be wrong

I guess your a right, different strokes...

 

Please don't let them CIO at this small age. They are just simply not ready.

my babies hated their bouncies but liked to be swaddled and in their swings. Also my son was lactose intolerant ( I just suspected it even though my do tor dismissed my concern saying he is just a baby and cries ) and once I switched his formula to lactose free, he became a happy happy boy. I also later found out that my baby girl has bad reflux to a point of refusing bottle and is now on medications twice a day. My point is, they don't just cry because they have nothing to do, I really beleive that something is bothering them. It is just so hard and takes such a long time to figure out what. Just try everything, white noise, music ( my son instantly quiets down to piano music ) swings, bouncies etc.

 

Yeah I agree with all those who say you shouldnt let a new born or baby a few months old CIO. I really don't even see how someone can do it. My little boy is a screamer. He gets hysterical as soon as he opens his eyes (its just how he communicates that he's awake) but he does not cry for long, protracted periods of time. Having said that though if he's crying while I'm making his bottle or until I can get to him, he is soooo upset. His little body is all clenched and his face is red and he gets overheated and starts sweating. I'm sorry but it cannot be good for babies that small to go through that for extended periods of time (and I agree with someone else that the OP contradicts herself in her posts so it seems like it is for long periods of time that she leaves them). Moreover I cannot even imagine what kinds of feelings of abandonment you are building up in them by leaving them alone to cry and be upset at that early stage. It just seems wrong.

 

We are going through a similar stage - the crying episodes and almost constant need to be held. Not wanting to repeat what others have suggested but get as much help/relief as you can so that it is not just you and your DH taking the brunt of the crying. If possible, have the grandparents watch the kiddies for a few hours and get out of the house or nap. We are fortunate enough to have both sets of grandparents in the city so they will often come over in the late aft/eve to watch the girls while I get a nap or my hubby and I go out for a walk or coffee. Or go to the expense of getting someone in to take care of the cleaning if it really bothers you - this stage won't last forever (I hope!) so you may be able to justify the expense in the short term.

As for methods for actually stopping the crying, we swaddle with the SwaddleMe blankets, apply some of the Happiest Baby on the Block methods (you can download the DVD on isohunt if you don't want to buy it), rock them in the glider, use swings/bouncy seats, use sound therapy machines, etc. - basically what everyone else has already said. Sometimes it doesn't work (or right away) but eventually they will calm down. You have to just take a deep breath and remember it won't last forever. Sometimes when I am alone with the two of them and they both won't stop crying despite the fact that I am holding both of them (or they won't let me put them down) I just have a good cry right along with them. It makes me feel better! One more thing - I recently downloaded Jewel's "Lullaby" CD which is very soothing for both mommies and babies. But try any music that you find relaxing and enjoyable. Best of luck to us all!!!

Oh yeah! Forgot to mention that the Moby Wrap is awesome. You can fit both of them in there if need be and still get some things done.

 

i didn't contradict myself what i neglected to do was to be more specific. i said that the crying could go on for hours meaning that you should prepare yourself for having to deal with a lot of crying...i wasn't specific. i also said that you should take a break for a bit if you need to, also didn't get specific as to how long you should let the break be. 5-10-15 minutes max, there is that better?

a child at this stage of the game is needy, yes they require you to come to them when they cry, yes they need to know that you are there for them and that you love them and that they can trust you but having been through abandoment issues myself with my own parents and through the advice of my doctors (for my kids and myself) the issues of adandoment don't come until the babies have more comprehension skills, when they can start to understand things. i have not created abandoment issues with my children for allowing them to cry for 15 minutes while i take a shower or a break or until they fall asleep. what i have done is create sanity in an otherwise insane household. if i can't take care of myself how can i possibly take care of my kids? parents need breaks too and if that means stepping away for 15 minutes then so be it. the kids are safe.

and if mine were crying like you mentioned yours were then this would be an entirely different ball game. when mine WAIL i'm right there until they stop but if it's just a cry then it can wait a minute or two.

i'm not going to appologize for what i said or have done and continue to do with my kids because IT WORKS and i didn't have any other options. spend a day in my shoes and you might understand that. everyone has different circumstances and certain things work best for certain people.

what i should have done was be more specific about time lengths, etc. because you all obviously got the impression that i just let my kids wail at the top of their lungs making themselves hoarse, blue in the face and unable to breath for hours on end without checking on them, craddling them or trying to soothe them. my fault.


what annoys me most about this entire post is that this mom is trying to find other solutions and avenues to try with her seemingly colicy babies and when i offered up a suggestion that wasn't on par with all of the parenting books, attachment parenting, something out of the norm i get shunned for it and it's a horrible idea. it all boils down to what works best for you and your family. everyone has different coping techniques and ways to parent their children.

this site is here for support right? well every post, even those that are "supportive" are met with judgement. without realizing that everyone is different a lot of people on here offer judgemental support, that if it's not done this way it's not right and causing all sorts of problems for the kids...soooo not the case. this should be a SAFE place for moms to come to discuss ALL methods of parenting WITHOUT being judged.

if you don't agree with what i had to do, fine, but don't judge it and say that i've created abandoment issues with my kids. or say it's totally wrong. parenting is a crap shoot, no one knows (not even the "experts") what's going to work and what's not going to work. it's TRIAL AND ERROR for everyone. each parent and each child is different and has different needs. we all do things differently, no one knows exactly how to raise the perfect child that is why there is no rule book or sure fire book to give you when you give birth. kids don''t come with instructions.

 

Sorry you are feeling judged, but in your first post you did state that they cry for hours on end. I am about as far as you can get from an "attachment parent" but even I would not let my babies cry for hours on end even today, and that is what your first post said. Even when a mom eventually does CIO, it is not for hours on end, day after day.

And yes, I read that now you are saying you only meant that they cry for a few minutes, but in your first post that's not what it said and that is what we've been addressing.

I think the reason that a lot of us have felt the need to address your post is because this is a forum to support moms who are in the very difficult stage of newborn twinfants, and we want to make sure that new moms aren't going to think that CIO at 1, 2, or 3 months old is something that we recommend.

 

no in my first post i just said they cried for hours on end, i didn't say that i LET them cry for hours on end. i also never said that i let them cry for days on end. one day it lasted for 6 straight hours but once again i did not say that i let them cry alone for 6 hours. i wasn't specific where i should have been.

yes but you shouldn't say "don't try it" either. if it works for someone, great. just because someone does CIO at a young age does not mean they are doing something wrong or that they are creating future problems down the road for their kids.

i mean, let's be realistic here...you can parent any way that you like, right or wrong. no one is an expert, not even the "experts" who write books. you won't know how well you did or what you did wrong until your kids turn into adults. letting them cry for a while or holding them constantly, no one knows what works best. so because you don't personally recommend it doesn't mean that the option shouldn't be there to try. you shouldn't have to feel the need to not offer up suggestions because the majority of the people on the forum don't recommend something.

 

Sorry that I have not been able to post but typing one handed just isnt for me.

I do swaddle, I do swing, I do bounce. However, I cant swaddle and do the otheres because the strap doesnt work in that manner to do it. I have a little help but they rock/hold etc. I do believe that you can spoil a baby even this small by holding 24/7 whether a book says it or not. They didnt get like this until people were here holding them ALL the time and I found the grandparents holding ALL the time. So yes, I do believe they can be spoiled. They used to enjoy the swing but not now

Both do have reflux and are meds for it once a day. I do not believe its colic. If it is, its definatly different than the colic I had as a baby and others that I heard about. They do get fussy but with colic there is no soothing. These babies cry and you pick up and they stop. To me, thats not colic. Colic they would be crying no matter what I do. I just want to be able to put them down for naps and I cant unless I hold one. My mom doesnt live here, she is 5 hours away so I do have limited help. I am back at work so MIL watches during the week so I cant ask her to watch at night or to help on the weekends. I just feel thats too much to ask.

If anyone can post a pic or explain how to strap them in bouncies and swings being swaddled, please do. Its prob our only saving at this time

 

I didn't swaddle, but was just looking back through my pics to see if I could find any where they were wrapped up and strapped in. Turns out...I didn't strap them in! My boys were so tiny that the two of them fit in the travel swing (close to the floor) together and would snuggle next to each other in the same bouncy chair. I hope you find some relief soon. FWIW, from 6-9 weeks old, from 7-9pm my boys were extremely fussy! It was just a phase and we survived!

 

"this site is here for support right? well every post, even those that are "supportive" are met with judgement. without realizing that everyone is different a lot of people on here offer judgemental support, that if it's not done this way it's not right and causing all sorts of problems for the kids...soooo not the case. this should be a SAFE place for moms to come to discuss ALL methods of parenting WITHOUT being judged."


Kristine,

You post on here about some of your personal challenges quite alot and there are many many people who offer you lots of support on a regular basis so I think its a little unfair to say that every post is met with judgment. People just happen to disagree with you on this issue -- as is their right.

"and if mine were crying like you mentioned yours were then this would be an entirely different ball game. when mine WAIL i'm right there until they stop but if it's just a cry then it can wait a minute or two . . . parents need breaks too and if that means stepping away for 15 minutes then so be it. the kids are safe."

I have been around babies my entire life and I have yet to see a newborn cry for this long without getting all worked up and upset. You must have a new breed of baby if they just calmly wail for 15 minutes. As for the abandonment issues, I don't know and neither do you whether babies will learn that no one is going to come for them if they are upset and crying. You say its impossible at that age but I'm not so sure given how much else babies are able to intuit about their environment and the people around them.

"it all boils down to what works best for you and your family. everyone has different coping techniques and ways to parent their children."

You know, you are right that all people parent differently and that none of us are experts, but I disagree that its just about what works. Just because something is effective does not make it right nor does it mean that you should do it. My mom beat the living crap out of me and swore at me constantly and it sure WORKED to keep me in line but I will not choose that method of parenting for my kids because it was unhealthy and detrimental to me as a person. As the saying goes, "we do better when we know better". And I think we pretty much know that even if it works, letting newborns cry it out isn't healthy and we should find different methods for calming our small babies.

 

How long, and what med? Was there a point where they seemed to feel better as far as the reflux, and then got worse?

 

i'm am soooooo sorry that happened to you. that is horrible and we all learn, or hope to learn, from our parents mistakes. mine thought drinking was more important then i was and i was also verbally abused and assualted by family members so i can somewhat relate. but it's still is about what works for you as a parent, so long as it's healthy. i in no way think it's ok to abuse your child. but i don't believe that letting them cry is abusive. only time will tell though, won't it? and no we don't know that letting newborns crying it out is healthy or not. you can read 100 different parenting books, talk to hundreds of different doctors, psychologists, what have you and you will get different responses from each and every one of them. no one knows for sure whether CIO at any stage of infancy is good or bad. the only way to know if we are good parents is to do our best, make the best decisions we can for our children, love them to pieces, guide them and show them the way, teach them to be good people and when they grow up and are adults we'll know if we succeeded. until then it's all about trial and error.

 

I am not against CIO, but seriously, a newborn?? :huh:

 

It sounds like a science experiment. I mean, no one really knows if TV is healthy or not for kids. So, I think I will put my kids in front of it all.day.long and wait until they grow up and see if it affected them. ardon: How many of those people have you talked to as stated above that think that CIO for newborns or small infants is appropriate? I am not going to wait until my kids grow up to be adults to find out if the choices I make are the right ones. I do my best, read what I can, ask what I can, talk to my Ped, etc. There is plenty of information out there to support that small infants should not CIO.

This is an excerpt from one of your latest threads here in FY this past week:


"the boys then got colic and cried constantly. i couldn't handle that. my temper got shorter with everyone. i was yelling at DH, refusing to let anyone come over and just making everyone very very distant from me. i would feed the boys, put them down and go right back to sleep and i did this ALL day long for weeks. i often found myself screaming and punching walls out of frustration when the boys would cry. i just couldn't handle it. and everyone kept telling me to hold them, hold them, they need you to love them to stop crying but i just couldn't bring myself to do it. even now, i don't hold them all the time...although it is getting better but i've got two! i can't coddle them!

so basically my motivation for life just went to hell. eventually i just stopped being able to take care of them and myself instead of just myself (that was 3 weeks ago). i got on meds and my dad came down for 2 1/2 weeks (he left yesterday) and things started to get back on track. i get up in the am, i get them fed, i do my "relax" time on-line and then start laundry and what not.

now i'm afraid that since he's gone and i'm alone again with just the t.v. for comfort that i won't have the motivation anymore. i won't have the desire. i'm afraid that everything will just fall apart again. god i am SOOOOOO scared of this. DH is going to work in a few minutes and i'll be alone until about 7pm. i've got chores to do but i just feel so overwhelmed by everything that i'm not even sure i'll be able to get them done.

and the kids...i don't know. i don't mind feeding them anymore but the stimulation part is still super hard for me. it's almost like i can't be bothered, you know? it's sounds awful but it's so hard for me to come out of my shell and be this person that openly communicates with these somewhat unresponsive creatures...

am i a totally bad mother?."


Here is where I think you are missing the bigger picture. Your babies need you. They need you to hold them. They need to know that you will be there for them. Letting them CIO, not holding them, and not being able to "stimulate" them, could lead to some issues IMO. Clearly you know what you are doing isnt probably the best thing or why would you be asking if you are a "totally bad mother?" Why not try and correct your issues while you can?