Discipline

My twins are 19 months old now. Is it too early to discipline them in some way? When did you start, and what form of discipline do you use? I'm not a big believer in spanking. Do time outs work?

What do you find effective?

Thanks!

 

I started as soon as they could crawl!!

 

I started disciplining mine from the time they can understand the word "no".

I prefer time outs, but you have to be really consistent. I do 1 minute of timeout for every year of age starting at 2. Prior to 2 I do "mini timeouts" by putting them away from the action for a minute or distract, redirect or remove.

These are my timeout rules:
1. 1st offense: 1 warning unless it's an automatic timeout behavior (see below)
2. 2nd offense: timeout
3. 3rd offense: timeout or doubled timeout (see below)
4. Timeout doesn't start until the crying has stopped.

Once they get the hang of timeouts down I implement "automatic double timeouts" for the 3 worst behaviors they have at the time. (Hitting, not obeying, etc). What that means is if a normal timeout is 2 minutes a double timeout is 4 minutes long.

Once they hit 3-ish I start doing "doubled timeouts" (I know, almost the same words) where if they do something they know they aren't supposed to do repeatedly they get timeouts that get progressively longer each time. For example

Emma touches the computer, does 2 minute timeout. Touches computer again, does 4 minute timeout. Touches computer yet again, does 6 minute time out.

I'm aware that some people find my timeout methods too harsh (like my MIL for example) but they really work well for us for the most part. You'll have to experiment to find the method that works best for you.

 

QUOTE(Her Royal Jennyness @ Aug 28 2007, 01:44 AM) [snapback]382922[/snapback]
I'm aware that some people find my timeout methods too harsh (like my MIL for example) but they really work well for us for the most part. You'll have to experiment to find the method that works best for you.


I don't find your timeout method harsh at all and I'm sorry to hear that MIL has to put her 2 cents in. I think beating your child or completely ignoring such behavior and letting them have the run of the house with no discipline is way more harsh than any timeout method could ever be.

 

As soon as my girls hit 18 months, I plan on doing the timeout method myself. I already have a packnplay in between our living rooms that I use for changing diapers downstairs so that will become our timeout area. At 18 months the time out will only be 1.5 minutes.

 

I started disciplining my girls when they understood "no". I started with a small hand slap, and still do for somethings. I've now started small timeouts and they've worked wonders for us. When they do "ugly behavior" like hitting their sister or me they first get a warning, if they continue I pick them up and put them on their sofa. I tell them that we don't hit and that they can get up when they are done being ugly. Most of the time they sit there for a second and get up in a better mood and act all lovey dovey, sometimes they get up mad and we have to do it a second time. I've never had to do it more then twice, and when they get up its like they're a different child. It works great for us, and the hitting as slowed down a lot. YAY!

 

I have a related question and I hope you don't mind...

How do you get them to STAY in timeout? I've literally spent hours marching them back to the place I put them over and over and they think it's a game. It doesn't help that they both want to be in timeout in the first place because they compete for attention whether it's positive or negative (and I'm home all day so it's not like they are starved for my attention in the first place). As soon as one does something and gets a timeout, the other immediately does the same thing so he can have a timeout. So I'm back and forth re-seating them. I tried putting them so they couldn't see each other and I swear they still got up at exactly the same time anyway. :help: I've been stern, I've been persistant, I've resorted to a swat on the rump (and felt horrible about it) because they were doing something dangerous and I was desperate to stop them. I know consistency is key but how long does it take for them to "get it"?!

Oh, and they learned to climb out of the PNP long ago so that doesn't cut it. I was only half joking when I told DH we should get two dog crates.

 

We do 1-2-3 magic timeouts! Works great! I started at 2 in earnest.

At first (above question) I put them in their feeding chairs and strapped them in facing away from the action! Now, they are in their boosters and faced the other way and if they get out, the time starts over.

I do auto timeout for hitting as well or if they act in appropriate with the dog!

 

I started as soon as my kids were mobile. I would much rather teach a 2 year old to obey than a four year old. The sooner the better in establishing boundaries.

We spank, I know a lot of people don't but we have had wonderful success with proper use of corporal punishment. We are in an "all boy" enviroment and they simply do not care about TIME OUTS or losing toys, or games, or movies. Considering that most kids can entertain themselves with a stick or a box, or just thier minds, it is little wonder that some kids don't respond at all to gentler discipline.

 

So far, all we've had to do is "the corner". Don't punish them in anger though. Keep a soft tone (although that is NOT always easy), gently take them to the corner and sit them down, and at 19 months old squat down to them and softly explain to them why they are there and what the correct behavior is...(example: Amber, you do NOT push sissy. That's not nice. It's very ugly and you could give sissy a an ouchy. <as she's crying> give mommy a hug, mommy loves you oodles, but I don't want you to be ugly. Now let's tell sissy sorry.) If she doesn't want to, she stays there until she's ready. Usually, it's not long at all and "I'm sorry" for the longest time basically consisted of them hugging each other which is fine because it's their way of expressing "I'm sorry" and that's okay because the intent is there. Now that they can talk really really well, I try very hard to get them to actually say it because they need to know that they need to say it. As they got older, they actually had to sit in the corner by themselves for a couple minutes or until they calmed down. Whatever the situation dictated for the punishment. Anyway, you get the idea. To date, we've not had to do anything else for punishment and only on a couple of occassions have both of them had to go to the corner at the same time and they went to completely opposite ends of the room. But I would start now with them so that they begin understanding that undesirable behavior has a negative consequence and also what behavior is undesirable. I know Amber stopped trying to bite us very soon after we began doing this and she's also chilled out on slapping or punishing.

 

Once my boys understood time-outs, I could move to the 3-2-1 warnings. In other words, "Stop hitting. Do you want a time-out? 3......2......" and it almost never went past me counting to 2 before they'd stop. That, to me, is the beauty of starting discipline early and somewhat "harshly". They learn that there are boundaries, that mama is serious when she asks something, and that there are consequences for not listening.

At first I picked the 2-3 most important offenses and focused on those (aside from the obvious super-dangerous ones like running in to the street, touching the heater, etc.). In our house it was hitting, biting, pushing. I'd give a stern "No biting. Time out. We don't bite." Then set the timer, or just count to 20. If they got up, it started over. I always just plopped my boys down away from the action, against a wall. No special place. That way I could stand behind them, and give the time-outs anywhere (the store, the park, the in-laws house). Once the time out is over, it's over. No more mentioning it. I'd just give them a hug and kiss.

The most important part of discipline for my boys was positive feedback. My boys responded to the negative consequences (time outs, taking toys away, leaving the park, etc.), but REALLY responded to my praise when they did things right. And that's hard to remember to do sometimes. Often we take good behavior for granted, but it's important to notice it and give lots and lots of praise when they do something you approve of (sharing, being gentle, helping, not throwing food, whatever!). My boys just puff up with pride and joy when I recognize them for being good -- it's by far the most effective tool for teaching them good behavior.

 

QUOTE(Ellen Barr @ Aug 28 2007, 11:37 AM) [snapback]383332[/snapback]
I always just plopped my boys down away from the action, against a wall. No special place. That way I could stand behind them, and give the time-outs anywhere (the store, the park, the in-laws house).


You make a really good point there Ellen. I will have to consider that idea when I start time outs.

 

We've started as they do understand the word no. They first get a warning, then we attempt a re-direct, and if that fails we do a short (1 minute or less) timeout. If they are digging in the garbage or toilet, they get a very slight hand slap and a "yucky", then re-directed. That's not working so far - they still want to play in the garbage and toilet!

I have the book "123 Magic" but haven't read it yet. But I need to, to see if we are ready to move onto anything else or just keep doing what is working okay right now.

 

I dont remember when we started but it was probably around the time they started crawling, about 10 months??? They are really good little girls that listen very well to both parents. We have no fighting, no biting, really no nothing. I believe alot of this is do to the fact that we do disipline for unacceptable behaviors and we are consistent about it. They both have bitten us once, all it took was a stern "no bite" and we removed them from the situation (us). As far as hitting each other, pretty much the same thing. If one hits the other, I grab the hitters arm (not hard) and say "no hit" and we remove them from the situation. We sit them down in an area that doesnt have any toys (not confided, just on the floor) and we tell them to sit. They usually do for a minute or so, then they are up to playing again. We do not spank, hit, slap, swat, etc.

They both play very well together, we get comments all the time about how well behaved they are and I truly believe it is b/c of the early disipline and the consistency.

 

We still don't use discipline (at 21 months) in the sense of punishment. The worst punishment they ever get is being ignored while they have a tantrum, or being removed from the situation against their will. I guess you could call that a timeout, but we don't call it that, or use it very systematically.

I think it's going to get harder when they get bigger and stronger. Right now, if they don't obey me, I can pretty much just pick them up and put them down somewhere else. Also, they are getting more persistent.

At daycare, I think they do something similar -- if a child is having a tantrum, they get sent to the "cool-off area." If they hit or bite another child, the DCP tells them calmly but sternly that what they did is unacceptable, and they have to apologize or give the victim a hug. If they refuse, they get sent to the cool-off area. So I guess that's basically timeout, but the difference is that the child comes out of the cool-off area when they're ready -- there's not a specific time limit. If they can cool down in 10 seconds and come back and be nice, that's fine. If they keep coming back and they're not calming down, a teacher will take them back to the area and stay there with them until they do.

I don't know what they do in really tough cases. I'll have to ask them. They must have some good method, because they have 10 toddlers in there, and they seem to behave in a pretty civilized fashion!

 

QUOTE(Ellen Barr @ Aug 28 2007, 11:37 AM) [snapback]383332[/snapback]
The most important part of discipline for my boys was positive feedback. My boys responded to the negative consequences (time outs, taking toys away, leaving the park, etc.), but REALLY responded to my praise when they did things right. And that's hard to remember to do sometimes. Often we take good behavior for granted, but it's important to notice it and give lots and lots of praise when they do something you approve of (sharing, being gentle, helping, not throwing food, whatever!). My boys just puff up with pride and joy when I recognize them for being good -- it's by far the most effective tool for teaching them good behavior.

I just wanted to second this. Its amazing how little ones just eat up the praise from their parents or close relatives. I watch my girl's faces light up when they get praised for doing good behavior. I think praise can be more powerful then discipline.