CIO

My babies have never been the greatest sleepers. At 8 months old, I still get up twice a night on a good night to try to soothe them back to sleep before things get out of hand. They also get up several times before I even go to bed. Sometimes one or the other will have a few good nights in a row, while the other is being awful. Then it flip flops and the other sleeps good for a period, but the first one is getting up again. It's not to eat, most of the time they go right back to sleep, so I've just dealt with it. Didn't seem like that big of a deal. Until recently. They've both had bad phases for the past couple weeks on and off. Currently, it's my son. He'll now start screaming as we turn to walk out of the room. If we go back to him, he stops immediately. Turn back around to leave and he starts again. In the middle of the night, when I used to find his pacifier for him, turn on his rainforest aquarium and walk away within 10 seconds it was fine. Now I try this and he sits up and screams bloody murder. So, does this sound like separation anxiety? Do you use CIO in situations like these, or does it make it worse (harder for him to overcome this phase?) Last night my husband was up with him from 2:30 - 5:00, trying to appease him. But anytime he tried to leave (after sitting with him, rocking him, laying with him, giving him motrin), he got the screaming again. Tonight we figured we can't let this go on. We let him cry. But I hadn't had a chance to really read up on it and my husband was taking charge now, not letting me give in like I normally would. I know I would get annoyed if he would overstep me and do something to change what I was trying to fix. So I tried to let him take the lead and I sat back since I didn't have the energy to start this on my own (but I was completely stressed, upset and wanting to go in there and pick him up and give him hugs the whole time). We did it in increments of 20 minutes and each time my husband went in he would stop and be happy to see him. He never picked him up, just rubbed his back for a couple minutes. As soon as he would turn to leave, he'd start back up full force, as if he'd never gone in at all. It took a full hour (3 20 minute increments) for him to fall asleep on his own. When we were sure he was asleep we checked on him and saw him sleeping draped over his bumper pads, holding on the the rails, as if he was still watching for one of us to come in. He had also spit up. I feel awful right now, thinking how sad he must be that we didn't come help him. So then I google CIO and see all these awful articles about how harmful this may be to a child's mental health and I feel even worse. I know there are other articles that say it's not harmful and it works. So how do you know? I never thought I was opposed to CIO, but at the same time I never thought I'd be in this position. I hoped the normal fussing it out for 5 minutes or so was all we needed. This really sucks.

Does this sound like a situation that calls for CIO?
Is there a better way to do this?
Have you found that it has worked?
Have you done it with any of your older children who are now well-adjusted and happy?

 

I feel your agony. I've been there and done that with my oldest DS. (He still has not slept through the night and comes in our room every night at about 3 am to sleep on a pallet on the floor. He's almost 8 years old.)

I remember trying to read the Ferber method book and trying the CIO. I'd go out in the garage and bawl. . . I just hated it.

There's two things I think now:
I instilled some bad sleep habits in my child early on by not letting him learn to fall asleep without my aid (nursed him to sleep, he co-slept with us for a long time, I ALWAYS responded quickly to his every whim and whimper).
And. . . I think it's just the personality of some people to want a companion with them as they fall asleep. Even big people can be like this.

I don't know what the answer is really.
I've let all of my children (except the twins just yet) CIO at some point. I had to. For my own sanity. My peds actually recommended it, and I can honestly say that none of my children have been harmed by it. At least not enough that I can tell at this point in their lives. I don't think they even remember it. My parents let me CIO at times when I was an infant, and I don't think I'm damaged by it. . . and I have the absolute BEST parents on earth! My relationship with them is not damaged.

You know your child and yourself better than anyone else on earth. You have to decide with your wisdom and instinct when to say, "This is best for my child in the long run," or "my child has had enough right now, and I must comfort him/her." Have confidence in yourself and try not to let mommy-guilt totally interfere.

I believe that sometimes CIO is the best and only answer. . . for instance, ever have an overly-tired and overly-stimulated child? Poor things just can't knock off no matter how tired they are? It's terrible, and the best thing you can do then is remove as much distraction and stimulation from them as possible. . . possibly including your presence.

But then there are times when CIO just seems terribly cruel. . . like when the child might have something wrong with them. . . an illness or an ear infection. (BTW, perhaps your child might have an undetected ear infection? Might rule that out with the ped.)

CIO is rough, but sometimes it can help free a child from interrupted sleep, bad sleep habits. For one to two weeks, it can be heck. But for a lifetime, it might help them develop good sleep habits that improve their health and keep them healthier. And it will help you be sane in the long run too.

Yes, my first child liked to have killed us with this issue it seems. He still drives us bonkers about sleep.

 

QUOTE(Emily@Home @ Nov 30 2008, 11:29 PM) [snapback]1091608[/snapback]
I feel your agony. I've been there and done that with my oldest DS. (He still has not slept through the night and comes in our room every night at about 3 am to sleep on a pallet on the floor. He's almost 8 years old.)

I remember trying to read the Ferber method book and trying the CIO. I'd go out in the garage and bawl. . . I just hated it.

There's two things I think now:
I instilled some bad sleep habits in my child early on by not letting him learn to fall asleep without my aid (nursed him to sleep, he co-slept with us for a long time, I ALWAYS responded quickly to his every whim and whimper).
And. . . I think it's just the personality of some people to want a companion with them as they fall asleep. Even big people can be like this.

I don't know what the answer is really.
I've let all of my children (except the twins just yet) CIO at some point. I had to. For my own sanity. My peds actually recommended it, and I can honestly say that none of my children have been harmed by it. At least not enough that I can tell at this point in their lives. I don't think they even remember it. My parents let me CIO at times when I was an infant, and I don't think I'm damaged by it. . . and I have the absolute BEST parents on earth! My relationship with them is not damaged.

You know your child and yourself better than anyone else on earth. You have to decide with your wisdom and instinct when to say, "This is best for my child in the long run," or "my child has had enough right now, and I must comfort him/her." Have confidence in yourself and try not to let mommy-guilt totally interfere.

I believe that sometimes CIO is the best and only answer. . . for instance, ever have an overly-tired and overly-stimulated child? Poor things just can't knock off no matter how tired they are? It's terrible, and the best thing you can do then is remove as much distraction and stimulation from them as possible. . . possibly including your presence.

But then there are times when CIO just seems terribly cruel. . . like when the child might have something wrong with them. . . an illness or an ear infection. (BTW, perhaps your child might have an undetected ear infection? Might rule that out with the ped.)

CIO is rough, but sometimes it can help free a child from interrupted sleep, bad sleep habits. For one to two weeks, it can be heck. But for a lifetime, it might help them develop good sleep habits that improve their health and keep them healthier. And it will help you be sane in the long run too.

Yes, my first child liked to have killed us with this issue it seems. He still drives us bonkers about sleep.


Thanks, this helps me feel a little better. Good to know that others have gone through it and survived. My son has been on antibiotics for an ear infection. But since he acts fine during the day, takes naps ok, lies down ok at night if you're there, and only cries as you start to leave and stops as soon as he sees you, we had thought it wasn't a "I'm in pain" cry. But again, how do you know? :huh: The ear infection was brought on by a cold, which is now gone. I'm afraid maybe he learned some bad habits while he was sick, since of course I got up for any peep when he was constantly waking up stuffy and coughing. But maybe it is still somehow related to illness. I wish he could just tell me what will help him go back to sleep!

 

I never believed in CIO before the twins and the end result was kids that slept with us until they were 3. Now with the twins I have had to use some very different methods than my first two. I have used the HSHHC (Healthy sleep habit happy child) technique that I modified to what worked best for the babies.

But basically for daytime naps I let them CIO for up to 45 minutes. They say you can go in and pat on the back but I found that it just made it worse. HSHHC said to let them CIO in the evenings until it was time for their next feeding or if you felt there was something medically wrong. I agree with PP to make sure there aren't any ear infections.

But it really sounds like they are having a had time self soothing. It really only takes 3-7 days for the CIO to really take effect normally. It is so extremely hard to just let them cry so I would normally go and take a shower or try to do something else so I wouldn't focus on the crying.

I believe they said that if they have had enough sleep during nap times (which I find is crucial to a good nights sleep) that the babies usually won't cry for more than 45 minutes. And we have found that to be true in our house as well. I also found that if I really looked at the clock and timed how long they were crying it usually wasn't as long as I thought it was. And when I would get to the point of saying- in 5 more minutes I'll go in, they would almost always stop crying in that 5 minutes.

I really don't think it will cause them long lasting trauma at all. Unfortunately you will find so many negative stories on the web that it over shadows the positive ones.

I would say to try it for a week and see if it helps (some version of CIO- HSHHC worked well for us, some people love the baby whisperer as well) and if not try something else. It can't hurt to try though.

Good Luck!

 

i just wanted to say that i have a good friend who works with children in schools who are classified, specifically, as having attachment disorders - and as she put it "it's most definitely NOT because their parents let them cry as children". don't know if that helps or not, but i found it a propos. let us know what you decide & how it goes. :hug:

 

Your post (and the replies) gave me inspiration tonight. We are dealing with similar issues. At one point we had both of the babies crying about 5 minutes before they would fall asleep, but then they've been getting cold after cold for the last two months. We started to rock them to sleep and then put them down after that. About three weeks ago, DS decided to wake up about an hour after going to sleep and would stay up for another hour after that before I finally coaxed him back to sleep or nursed him to sleep in my own bed. Unfortunately, this meant I usually had to give up pumping those evenings since I nursed him and would end up not having enough milk for the next day. I also would race to get dinner in before he woke up because I knew as soon as he did I was probably not going to eat or get any work done for the rest of the night.

Tonight we not only let him cry it out to go to sleep (for about 10 minutes), but I also let him cry it out when he woke up that hour after we put him down. He cried about 20 minutes, but I think because he did fall asleep earlier when we put him down it was easier for him to fall back asleep this time. (Usually I ended up getting him after about 20 minutes because it just seemed like he was not going to give up.)

I agree that it is not the situation I expected to be in either, but I'm right there with you and am at point where I've just had enough of the fighting sleep syndrome. I also read HSHHC and we definitely started off going with everything the author said, but seemed to get off track and need to go through the painful experience of getting back to what we know is best for them and their own sleep habits.

Good luck and know I will be thinking about you as we are going through the same thing here!

 

CIO is such an emotive subject. I am personally against cio in young babies. But I am also practical and know that after 8 months or so, if you know your baby does not need food and is waking from habit or is unable to self soothe then I don't believe controlled crying has any long term effects. Unfortunately on this site I do find people too quick to advise cio and in young babies too which makes me sad. I used the baby whisperer method with my daughter when she wouldn't sleep in her crib (after sleeping on me for 3months!) It took a lot of effort but we got there in the end after a few days. It does sound like separation anxiety on which I don't have any experience. Elliot went through a similar phase at 6 months but because it was only 1 twin I handled it and had just about had enough when he sttn at around 7 half months. I rock both mine to sleep but have decided once they turn 1 that is enough and am prepared there is going to be some crying! I think the main thing is consistency. I don't think 1 hour before he fell asleep is uncommon. As long as you are consistent in your method - and there are many - then it can work. But then there are mums who will tell you it never worked for them.

I think I just rambled on and on then instead of being helpful! Good luck and hope whatever your choose to do works out!

 

QUOTE(Fireweed in AK @ Dec 1 2008, 01:59 AM) [snapback]1091671[/snapback]
Your post (and the replies) gave me inspiration tonight. We are dealing with similar issues. At one point we had both of the babies crying about 5 minutes before they would fall asleep, but then they've been getting cold after cold for the last two months.


This is exactly us too. And usually they didn't even cry. Normally would play and talk and then fall asleep on their own. I'm wondering if they got sick at the "wrong" time, like some bad transitional age or something. Like maybe they're old enough to understand cause and effect. And they remember mommy used to come in and pick them up any time they woke up just a short while ago when they were sick, why did she stop?
I hope your night has gone well, and that it won't take too many more. My son woke up once and I let him cry 10 minutes. He stopped, so I waited and then snuck in to check on him. I crawled in on my hands and knees - he is the worlds lightest sleeper (guess he takes after me) and anything makes him pick his head up. I found him sleeping. Then I went to check on his sister and spent some time repositioning her. As soon as I went to sneak back out, my son was up and screaming again. Nice going mom. It took about 10 minutes again, but this time it was all my fault so I felt worse. So once he stopped, ridiculously stupid me decides to go check on him yet again again, because i can't go back to sleep wondering if he's still breathing or sleeping in vomit. So here we go all over again with the crying for a third time. He stopped quickly that time. Guess I can't check on him, unless I want to continue to torture him even more. I hope this doesn't go on too many nights!