CIO with Preemies

Not that I am anywhere close to starting CIO with my girls, as they are still in the NICU. But I was reading through my preemie book and it said that you should NEVER let a preemie CIO. Is this true? Or at a certain age is it ok? Like I said, it will be a while before I tried it, and I won't do it at all if it is going to harm my girls but it really seems to work for a lot of people.

 

Wow, I have never heard that. But I really never let mine do it for too long. Mine were born 8 weeks early and when they woke throughout night, I just fed them. I figured as long as they were taking the bottle then they were hungry and there was no need to let them cry. But I did let them do some crying to get them to learn how to fall asleep on their own probably around the 7 month mark. Those night were hard, but well worth it.

 

That's interesting, I hadn't heard that before. Did they say why preemies should never CIO?

As you take adjusted age into account, I don't see why this should be off limits for preemies. Mine were 6 wks early (not as early as yours, but still not full-term), and around 5 months corrected age we started CIO for naps and bedtime. It's worked great, and the babies are fine with it. We don't CIO in the middle of the night - if they wake up, we feed them - but that's because when they wake up they're hungry and need to eat.

 

QUOTE(fuchsiagroan @ Nov 30 2007, 04:02 PM) [snapback]516052[/snapback]
That's interesting, I hadn't heard that before. Did they say why preemies should never CIO?


Because it can cause their oxygen saturation to go way down, and they can't regulate it as well as a full term baby would be able to. But it didn't say if when they get older if its OK?

 

QUOTE
Because it can cause their oxygen saturation to go way down, and they can't regulate it as well as a full term baby would be able to. But it didn't say if when they get older if its OK?


I would think that once they're older it shouldn't be a problem, unless they have continuing respiratory issues. (But I am not a doctor, nor do I play one on tv!!!) My babies had some minor respiratory problems at birth (DD was intubated, then on cannula; DS was fine at first, then kept having desats after a while), and they've never had an issue with CIO.

Could you maybe ask one of the neonatologists at the NICU about this? I'd be really curious to hear what they have to say.

 

I will try to remember to run it by the neonatologist tomorrow and see what he has to say about it. I will let you know.

 

Like a pp said, I'm not a doctor, but I'm sure the book is referring to preemies under the adjusted age of 6 months or who have complications of some sort. Ainsley had respiratory issues but she was fine once we left the hospital and she had no problems with CIO after 6 months.

 

Agreeing with the PP - It's not a good idea at all for preemies but once they get older (adjusted age 3-4 months) then I don't see why it would be a problem. We didn't do CIO with our 33 weekers until they hit about 3-3.5 months adjusted age. We looked for signs that they were crying simply to see us appear and then the CIO worked very well for us. I found the NICU situation to be very difficult because sometimes the nurses had no choice but to CIO with babies. They would be working with another child and sometimes babies just had to wait. UGH - I hated to hear that crying.

 

No reputable doctor/child development expert recommends any CIO before the age of 6 months. Just because "it seems to work" doesn't mean it is recommended or desirable. People used to give babies brandy to get them to sleep too. I would think that until your babies are adjusted age of at least 6 months you wouldn't want to do any CIO. And just so you know - there are LOTS of ways to help babies learn to help self-soothe that don't involve leaving them alone to cry.

 

QUOTE(Mimsy @ Dec 1 2007, 05:24 AM) [snapback]516529[/snapback]
And just so you know - there are LOTS of ways to help babies learn to help self-soothe that don't involve leaving them alone to cry.


Im a first time mom, and I would love to hear the other ways that parents help their babies to be able to self-soothe and go to sleep. CIO just seemed to be the most common which is why I inquired about it.

 

Elizabeth Pantley has a couple of goof books that are the pick-up/put down method. The Baby Whisperer has some good stuff. Sometimes other methods involve crying, but not alone. I had sleep issues with my older DD, and again with my DS. I used what is called "gradual extinction". That means that the baby is in the crib, and probably crying, but a parent is always with the baby. I sat beside the bed, and sang and shushed and patted. THen when they stopped crying I slowly stopped doing those things. Eventually I could just pat, then just sit beside the crib, then just sit across the room, then in the door etc. That was for my older DD - she was a challenge. I felt like even if she was crying, she knew I was there and trying to comfot her. DS I just did something similar with this week - we have been having serious issues with multiple night waking etc and I have another baby to look after too, so I needed him to sleep better. It toolk one night of soothing and patting (I think this works better when they are old enough to tummy sleep) and he cried off and on for abot 45 min. THe next day for naps he went down with little fussing, and tonight he fussed for about 1 minute.
Yes, CIO often works, but it is only common in the Western world, specifically English speaking countries. Most people from other countries are pretty horrified that leaving a baby to cry is considered "teaching them to self-soothe" or "teaching them to sleep".
I used to not have a strong opinion one way or the other, until a friend told me to replace "baby" with "aged parent" in reading about CIO. If my mother or father were in a care facility and the staff let them cry at night so they would learn to sleep or learn to go back to sleep I would be livid. If it isn't okay for other helpless people why is it okay for our tiny helpless children?
Okay, off my soapbox now...

 

Also, a lot of babies learn to go to sleep on their own just fine, and their parents don't need to "train" them. I have two friends with preemies who say that they always put themselves to sleep because that it what they were used to in the NICU. Hopefully you won't even need to figure out what to do because your babes learn it in their own time.

 

QUOTE(Kyrstyn @ Dec 1 2007, 03:17 PM) [snapback]516643[/snapback]
Im a first time mom, and I would love to hear the other ways that parents help their babies to be able to self-soothe and go to sleep. CIO just seemed to be the most common which is why I inquired about it.


Back in the day when mine were infants,
many people on this board were
recommending the book "healthy sleep
habits, happy baby" by Marc Weisbluth. I
picked it up and found it meshed with what
I felt comfortable in doing to help my babies
fall asleep on their own.

I am another one that was never comfortable with the
whole concept of letting either of my babies "cry it out"

The things that soothed them at various times were:
being swaddled, sucking their binkies, sitting in
the bouncy seat with it on vibrate, and as they got a
little older, the swing. I have also always had some
sort of "white noise" on in their room for sleep times.

I also did not get them on a nap "schedule" until
they slept through the night (which they did on their
own at around 4.5 months. With NO cio)

I hope you find something that you will be comfortable
doing, but like a PP said, it may not even be an
issue.

 

I have never heard that. We did CIO with our two at 10 months. We didn't need it before, but they suddenly started waking just to be awake and thought it was play time.

 

Thanks for all the helpful advice. I am going to look into some of those books with alternatives to CIO. I dont know that I could bear listening to my baby scream.

 

QUOTE(Mimsy @ Dec 1 2007, 05:46 PM) [snapback]516755[/snapback]
I used to not have a strong opinion one way or the other, until a friend told me to replace "baby" with "aged parent" in reading about CIO. If my mother or father were in a care facility and the staff let them cry at night so they would learn to sleep or learn to go back to sleep I would be livid. If it isn't okay for other helpless people why is it okay for our tiny helpless children?
Okay, off my soapbox now...


I'm by no means a CIO-is-the-only-way advocate but that just doesn't make sense. There's a huge difference between a baby and an elderly person.

We used CIO to establish a bedtime but I really liked "The No-Cry Sleep Solution" when I was teaching the girls to sleep through the night. You may want to look into it if your little ones still are sleeping through after 7-8 months old or so. What works best will depend on your temperment and the temperments of your babies. You'll know what to do when the time comes. Like others have said, you may even get babies who sleep through all by themselves.

 

I do not feel at all comfortable letting mine CIO. My older two I never really had any sleep problems with but the twins just neet mama at night. I just feel like right now they need me and I would not be able to handle them crying right now. I was wondering the same thing about premies. Mine were early too and they are just now reaching one month old baby milestones and they are already almost 3 months old. They are way behind on development. So many people tell me to let them cry at night but I just can't do it. Even their ped. doctor said for me to put them in their cribs and just turn down the baby monitor and let them cry a little bit. (by the way they sleep in bassinets that fit in our bed now). I just feel strongly that I know my babies more than anyone else and to let them cry like that would be wrong.

 

QUOTE
I'm by no means a CIO-is-the-only-way advocate but that just doesn't make sense. There's a huge difference between a baby and an elderly person.


Not if we are talking about an elderly person who has lost the ability to communicate (dementia, stroke etc). Then you are talking about two dependant people who can not communicate their needs. Just one is old and one is young.

 

QUOTE
Mine were early too and they are just now reaching one month old baby milestones and they are already almost 3 months old. They are way behind on development. So many people tell me to let them cry at night but I just can't do it.


This is partly an aside from the original thread - but your babies are NOT behind on development! Always, always, ALWAYS go by their corrected age. Your babies came almost 2 months early! Just pretend they were born on their due date and pretend that's their real age. If they're acting like 1 month olds, then they are RIGHT ON TRACK with development, not behind! Coming out of the womb does NOT fast-forward a 33 wk fetus to the maturity level of a 40 wk newborn.

And even if your babies were really 3 months old, anyone who tells you to let them CIO at that age is wrong, IMO. CIO is only appropriate once babies can self-soothe, and most 3 mo olds can't. We tried a little CIO at 4.5 mo corrected age, and it was too early; around 5 mo corrected age, it worked, because the babies had gotten good enough at self-soothing.

About CIO in general - I think it's fine under certain conditions:

-the babies are old enough to self-soothe
-they're put down to sleep when they're tired but not overtired
-all their needs are met (fed, burped, changed, warm, AND some quiet time for soothing/snuggling before going down) and nothing else is wrong (sick, having a really bad time with teething, etc)

If all this stuff applies and the babies still cry going down, I consider it protest crying. They need sleep, but they want to stay up and play. And in this case, their needs are more important than their wants. Under those circumstances, I think CIO isn't much different from having a toddler throw a tantrum because they get fruit instead of ice cream for dessert.