Still Waking at Night

My boys, Adam and Austin, are 14-1/2 months old. They moved into adjacent cribs in their own room at 6 months. They are still breast-fed (separately) upon waking in the morning, before morning and afternoon naps, at bedtime, and -- the reason for this thread -- when they wake at night.

To date, they have never achieved sleeping through the night. (Occasionally, one has, but never both.) I have two older dds, who are 12 and 11, and during last school year, I always rushed in to grab the crying twin in order to let the girls have their uninterrupted sleep. The plan was, the day school let out, the boys were going to have to CIO.

Well, here we are at the start of another school year, and I caved. I never had the boys CIO during the summer. It is always one of them who starts crying, and wakes the other. However, when I go into get the crier, the other one (who is still lying down, even if awake), pops up in a flash and starts crying to be taken out. So, one comes out, gets nursed, (while the other one lies in his crib crying and waiting, or is taken out and held by dh, often still crying and waiting), then after I put the first one down, I nurse the second, and put him back down.

The boys go to bed around 8:00 - 8:45 pm (by the time I'm done nursing both), and at least one of them wakes up anywhere between 11:30 pm to 1:00 am. Sometimes, there is a second waking up between 4:00 - 5:15 am. They wake up in the morning between 6:30 - 7:15 am, take a morning nap between 9:30 - 10:30 am for about an hour or more, and an afternoon nap around 3:00 pm for an hour or two. Austin has always been the better napper, usually goes right out, Adam always cries and cries during nap times but usually finally falls asleep, (and often cries at bed time as well), but when I take Adam out because he is crying too much he is obviously exhausted and needs the naps.

The few times dh and I have tried letting them CIO during the night, it has been an unmitigated disaster. One may try to settle after crying for twenty minutes, but the other one is crying so much that he gets the first one going again and they end up making each other hysterical (that choking, coughing, I can't breathe hysterical crying). On two different occasions we tried to stick to our guns, and after a full hour of hysterical crying by one of them, we couldn't take it anymore and gave in and pulled him out. After those experiences, it is easier to just go in and quickly grab the one who starts crying as quickly as possible before the other one wakes.

We are at the end of our ropes. I have not had one uninterrupted night's sleep since they were born. I really can't take it anymore. With our dds, we were able to do CIO around 8 months with each, and since it was just the one of them, it worked beautifully after only handful of nights and they slept through the night. The twin thing just complicates everything so much, and we feel so frustrated. I had hoped to wean them around 15 months, but it doesn't look like I am anywhere near that being a possibility (something to discuss more fully on the breastfeeding forum!).

Thanks for listening!

 

:hug: to you for going this long without a full night's sleep! I couldn't do it! :lol:

Do you have white noise going in their room? (fan, staticky radio, white noise machine). Have you thought about using lullabies? I have both a fan and lullabies for my kids. I started using the lullabies at birth and it now instantly calms them down unless there's a serious problem. They know when the lullabies start, that it's time for sleep, whether it's nap or bedtime.

They are getting older, which means it's going to get harder to night wean as well as get them to sleep through the night, because they are smart enough to realize that if they cry harder, mommy and daddy will come and get them. You'll really have to set your mind to doing CIO and stick with it if it's going to work successfully. Doing CIO with twins is definitely more challenging. If there's any way to split them up, one in a pack n play in another room, that might help. But, if you are like us, and don't have the rooms for that....you may just have to bite the bullet and let them both cry for a few nights. When they start the hysterical crying you can calm them down without picking them up, by snuggling them when they are standing at the crib rail, talking softly and rubbing their back until they settle down.

I never did full on CIO, I did more of a modifed CIO, by going in every few mins, when the upset/hurt feelings cry turned into the "SHE LEFT ME" cries! :lol: The first night was always 4-6 hrs of crying, but within a week all my kids were sleeping through the night.

Good luck! :hug:

 

Jack had a rash of night-wakings from 10-13 months. It was so bad (waking multiple times per night) that I almost had to quit my job because I could not function. So I have a small idea of what you're going through; you must be exhausted! :hug:

We tried everything (cosleeping, pick-up-put-down, rocking to sleep, and even one time of CIO) and nothing worked. I finally hit upon the notion of talking to him about bedtime, what to expect, and what was expected of him. We called it a "pep talk", and still give it to this day. The day I started doing this, he started to go back to STTN. He's still my worst sleeper, but 99% of the time when he wakes he either goes back to sleep on his own, or we rock him for a few minutes, repeat the pep talk, and he goes right back down.

Your boys are old enough to start understanding the concept of night-time. If CIO doesn't work for you, then I might try telling them "night time is for sleeping, Mama and Dada need sleep too, time to close your eyes and dream good dreams, Mama and Dada are right there, you're never alone, etc."

If they're waking to nurse, then you might want to stop that as well. Jack weaned early, and Nate would go back to sleep quicker if I nursed him, but he almost never woke up in the first place. ardon: If you do stop nursing at night and *don't* do CIO, then you might want to have DH go get them for a while so they get the idea that the "all night milk bar" is closed! :lol:

Good luck, and I really hope you find something that works for you! :hug:

 

Thanks Danielle for your response. We used music when we first moved them into their cribs, but then stopped after a few weeks, and now I'm not really sure why we did! My dh has suggested that a few times as well, I never disagreed, but I guess I have just been too tired to follow through! lol.

How old were your kids when you did your modified CIO? You mentioned 4-6 hours of crying!?! I'm assuming you mean crying on and off, going back in and back out of the room endless times, all night long for the first night? What happened after that? Did it slowly subside to fewer and fewer hours until they just "got it" and slept through? With my dds, it took about 45 min to an hour of crying for just a few nights for them to get it, and that was when they were around 8 mos. old.

I agree with you that they are getting older and wiser, and I fear I may have made this whole process so much worse by not following through with my early summer plan for CIO when they were just under a year. We won't separate them, due to lack of room, and also because I really want them to be together, through thick and thin! We separated our dds when they were tiny (they are 15-1/2 months apart) and I always have regretted that they never shared a room.

Thanks so much for your input and support.

 

The music has really helped all 4 of my kids, it's part of our bedtime routine, and the twins like to turn the lullabies on themselves sometimes too. A lot of people don't like it, having to rely on it, so it's really a personal choice

I did modified CIO with my oldest at 10 months, he was co-sleeping with us most of the time. I did it with my oldest dd at 8 months, again a part time co-sleeper. With the twins, I first did it with Rylee at 4.5 months old. She was becoming dependent on sleeping with us and I couldn't have that with twins. It only took her one night of crying for about 45 mins. I did it again at 10 months old when we moved them out of our room and into their room. That first night was a lot of crying, alternately, for at least 3 hrs. We would continually go in, at first every couple mins, then extending the time, and trying to wait for their cries to change from being mad/upset into being scared and confused. But it only took 1 night of horrible crying, within a couple of nights they were going to sleep easily. Now, some nights we have to go back in once or twice, Liam is a chatterer, but nothing like those first few nights.

But, as you realize, the night weaning is a big part of it, and it's going to be harder to wean and teach them to go to sleep all at once. You might try weaning first, instead of offering mommy milk, offer water in a sippy cup. They may stop waking up naturally once they realize they aren't going to get the good stuff anymore And if they don't, you can always leave the water cup in the bed if you want.

 

Hi, we had to do a modified CIO with our twins around 12.5 months. We went and checked on them every 5, 10, 15 minutes. We used bottles, but weaned them off within a week. I completely agree with talking to them about your plan. Let them know that Mommy and Daddy will be making some changes and reassure them you are confident they can be big kids now. We met with a sleep specialist to come up with our plan. If you want me to post it, let me know. I saved it in a file. Some of it may be helpful for you. The first week was difficult (especially the first few nights), but it was much better after that. Ours share a room, too. We don't have space for separate rooms. You will feel so much better when everyone is sleeping at night. I felt like a new woman! whew...

 

If it makes you feel better I have almost 18 month olds that wake up almost every night usually around 3 a.m. and they may stay awake for two to three hours. I am miserably exhausted, no to mention 34 weeks pregnant. I have tried everything, giving them milk, giving them water, going in there, letting them cry, white noise, night lights, if you can think of I have tried it. They have been doing this since before they turned one. It started as one night every couple of weeks and has continually progressed to five or six nights per week. It has even started affecting their naps during the day becauuse they are so sleep deprived. The best advice I can give you is to definitely ween the feedings in the middle of the night because that has just become habbit. They should not need to eat in the middle of the night anymore. Also, CIO is the only thing that even remotely works for us. When I hear mine wake crying I go in and check on them to make sure there in nothing wrong (fever, dirty diaper etc), pat their back very quickly, tuen on a musical seahorse that they love, and walk out of the room. I am only in there for maybe three minutes, and I never turn on lights or speak to them. SOme nights they will go back to sleep in 30 minutes. Ohter nights it takes them three hours. But they have learned that crying and screaming is not gonna get them anywhere. SO even when they up that long it is a lil fussing now and then and the rest of the time they are laying in there cribs quiet and playing or trying to go back to sleep. What I am telling you may not make them sleep all night long, but HOpefully it will help some. From one really tired mom to another.......I feel for you.

 

I would LOVE for you to post the sleep plan! It is super of you to offer. I couldn't have said it better: We will all feel so much better when EVERYONE is sleeping at night, my dh, me, and the boys! I am eager to get started. We are so desperate. Thanks SO MUCH!!

 

Oh my goodness, I can't imagine adding third-trimester pregnancy to night-waking 18-month olds!! That is just too, too awful! You must be beside yourself. It does sound like you are on the right track, having them understand that they are not getting picked up and taken out at that hour of the morning. Hopefully they will slowly fall back to sleep in shorter and shorter amounts of time. I cannot imagine having my boys wake up at 3 a.m. and not go back down. When mine wake up, even though we have been taking them out to nurse, there is never any talking to them, or lights turned on (other than the light in our room on the faintest dimmer setting so I can see what I'm doing!) or any other communication other than they nurse (in bed with me), and then I put them right back down without saying a word. Almost always -- 95% of the time -- they go right back to sleep, only very rarely do they then stay awake and cry.

Thanks for your advice and support, and I will pray that yours become better sleepers ASAP before your new baby comes! I certainly hope you have some support from family and/or friends for when your new baby arrives. That is going to be a tough situation for you. I wish you the very best of luck with your twins, your delivery, and your new baby when he/she arrives!

 

I love your idea about water in sippy cups and leaving them in their cribs if necessary. Hopefully you are right, and once the "good stuff" is no longer available, they will sleep. I pray that it will work. We are planning to try it out within the next few days: I just want to make sure we are both ready for it and know exactly how we are going to proceed, because when we abruptly try to do something about it at 1:00 or 3:00 in the morning, we are just too delirious and ill-prepared and end up getting upset with each other, so we definitely need to have a plan in place to make this thing happen. I will keep you posted as things progress. Thanks so much for the help!