Still struggling with their behavior

My boys have just turned 5 and we are having horrible struggles with their behavior. You may have seen my recent post about insufficient sleep (at least in my opinion). But it goes beyond that.

William: Terrible temper. Back talks. When he can't do something...either not allowed to or physically can't do it (such as open a container of yogurt or something silly like that)...he absolutely flips out with kicking, stomping, crying. He is very physical and will hit/throw at his twin (sometimes little sister) if he gets angry.

Matthew: Back talker. WHINER. Cries/melts down if he can't do something...either not allowed to or physically can't (see William).

Both of them have recently been blaming everyone but themselves for their mistakes. For example, he William trips over a stick in the yard he FLIPS OUT and blames me for the stick being in the yard. Or, if Matt spills his milk and I'm in the other room, it's somehow MY fault (this generally I'm not too concerned about...jsut annoying).

Anyway, we are very consistent with consequences (early bed, no dessert, time-outs) and we follow through with our punishments. I think it's too the point where no consequence thus far has gotten to snap out of it.

I've thought about a chart again (first time around at age 4 was a failure...they could care less) but am worried I won't remember to actually chart. Anyone have any other similar suggestions to encourage better behavior? I really just want to enjoy my children rather than feeling like I'm punishing them all the time

 

Honestly, for better or worse, they sound like my Timothy amplified. Timothy gets easily and vocally frustrated quite easily. He'll come across a word he doesn't recognize and start whining about what is it and he'll never learn how to read, etc, etc. He gets whiny and complainy when he can't physically do something the first time, like not making 6 baskets in a row and only making 5. And yes, he was yelling at the ball because it was entirely and wholly the ball's fault. Timothy never gets physical, but he does do a lot of back talking. He's always been like this to varying degrees.

I have a couple of strategies for dealing without him. First is sleep and food. If he's tired, it's worse. If he's hungry, it's worse. When sleep is the problem, his punishment will be having to go lay down on his bed for about 30 mins and just calm down. If he's hungry, we just get snack.

The other big thing is I just don't take it personal. When he's trying, like tonight, to figure out basketball and the coordination, I just keep on being his cheerleader. I just keep encouraging him to try again and help him when he wants it. I don't do negative with him. His head already has that negative soundtrack running in it. I keep a constant positive encouragement with him.

Timothy does better with more individual time. I try and take him bowling some just me and him so he can take his competitive out with me and not his sister. He also does better with 3rd party adults. He an absolutely perfectly behaved kid at school (according to his teachers). He is absolutely perfect in swim lessons. But when I'm teaching him piano, it's mini-meltdowns, whining, and the negative soundtrack. And when he comes home from school, he tends to bounce off the wall from the effort of keeping everything together at school.

Timothy is honestly a sweet boy. He can be so cuddly and snuggly and wants to spend time with us so much. He wants to be helpful and is always looking for ways to help adults. He is also fiercely competitive and wants to be the best at everything. He has trouble handling frustrations. We've worked on just calming down and practicing whatever it is more. I've learned that he does best with plenty of sleep and food. He also just needs to be physical: ride bikes, climb trees, chase his soccer ball around. And he needs a competitive outlet, preferably one-on-one with a grown-up and away from his sister.

I hope some of this helps. It's kind of rambly, but I just wanted you to know that there are other little boys out there with some of the same things happening. It can be wonderful for a month, and then we'll have a week where I wonder if he and I'll make it through.

Marissa


Something else that has helped is he's taken up shooting. Timothy has his own .22. He absolutely loves getting up and going squirrel hunting with daddy or going to the shooting range. He is quite aware that it is a very grown-up activity and that if he even thinks about melting-down, complaining or anything, he is done for a while. It's taught him how to control some of his frustrations. He's also pretty good at it and has shot a squirrel that we ate for dinner. But he has grasped the responsibility and grown-upness of shooting and has modified his behavior quite a bit to get to continue that.

 

I have one that is a 'challenge' to parent due to her dominant personality, perfectionism, and desire to take charge/do it her way. She turns 5 in OCt and we see a lot of 'power struggles' right now and blame on sister or me for things. Sort of like you describe- right down to the stomping of feet and gnashing of teeth.



Things that we have found worked (most of the time):

1. Use "I" and " You" language. and choices. For example: DD1 chose to yell at bedtime after discussing what the rules/concequences are. We restate SHE CHOOSE to yell, since she yelled the bed stuffie was taken away. SHE made the choice to yell. Or for frustrations= " I see you are frustrated that you cant open the garbage can. May I help you?" THat way she feels some ownership of her emotions and she is asking US for help instead of us jumping right in.

2. Choices. We give her a lot of choices- red or blue, vanilla or chocolate....etc. THat way she has some control and power over her world, which she seems to need.

3. Whining: I choose not to 'understand' them if either one of DD whine. They still whine, but almost immediately will ask nicely afterward since I dont respond to the whines. Everynow and then we get a nuclear meltdown if they whine and I ignore the reponse, but it is rare now.

4. State natural concequences. If you go outside when it is cold, put on your coat. If they forget teh coat or refuse to wear it----I try *depending on situation and safety issues* to let them have a natural concequence. If you dont eat lunch, you will be hungry later. If they are - I remind them why and say they ahve to wait for dinner/lunch/snack, etc.


She is usually good for other people as well....though she has given her teacher a run for her money some days. I have found that positive praise and encouragment of what she does RIGHT and well is helpful and encourages her to do it more often.

Some days are tough....on days with too little sleep it is worse for us as well. :grouphug: I hope it gets better for you in time!

 

Gabe used to fly off the handle about everything. Any little thing that was not the way he pictured it or wanted it and he freaked out. I'm talking screaming, hitting, kicking, throwing things, etc. There are 3 things that we have changed in the last 6 months. One, we started Gabe in martial arts. He loves it and is learning so many skills and his instructor is just awesome. He really drives home to respect you parents. Second, I know we've all heard so much about it, but we started using 123 Magic. I was very doubtful that it would work, but it as done wonders! Third, Gabe needs to eat pretty often and needs snacks with protein in them. When he starts getting emotional, usually now it's that he needs to eat something and needs it NOW. This kid has done a compete 180 and is such a joy to be around now. Before, I didn't want to get out of bed knowing what I would deal with that day. I started seeing a counselor and honestly only went to her 3 times b/c his behavior changed so drastically when the 123 Magic was added in. I don't feel like I'm screaming and just at the end of my rope all the time anymore.

 

My boys have their moments but it's nowhere near what you're describing. I hope you find some answers.

A couple of questions, though. How do you react when they fly off the handle? What does their pediatrician say about their behavior? Have you done any reading about food/chemical sensitivities? I recall hearing that behavior can be strongly influenced in some kids by intolerances that are otherwise unnoticed (i.e. no hives)

Just thinking out loud...

 

I'll throw in another recommendation for 1-2-3 Magic. It was a lifesaver for us (since me husband doesn't really like to discipline -- even the positive kind!)

There is a DVD -- we rented it from the local library, and my DH and I watched it together and started to implement it. (Just FYI -- there is a section specifically on back talk.) Then, I got the book, too. I've been VERY pleased with the results.

We have also found that good sleep really helps, so that having a short pre-bedtime routine (with a fast bath, if possible), and then calming time in their rooms before lights out helps. Its hard to do now, when the days are so long, but we aim for 11 hours of sleep a night.

And, my kids need gross motor time -- every day. Park or playground, riding bikes, hikes, swimming pool, backyard -- anything to work off the boundless energy. We also institute quiet/rest times in their rooms, every day. The quiet time gives them a "break" from each other, let's them "practice" entertaining themselves, and let's them know that downtime for everyone each day is a good thing. We've had some non-restful rest times, believe me, but overall, I think that's helped.

We definitely still have moments -- everything totally fell to pieces towards the end of our family vacation (too many late nights, no rest times, more leniency with behaviour, etc.) and it has taken us a full week back home to get everyone rested up and back to normal.



Good luck!!!!

Meg -- mom to 4 year old b/g twins, but lurking in the 5-11 forum!

 

Just wanted to say thanks for the suggestions and commisteration I'm going to re-read 123 Magic. We do use some of the techniques but perhaps a re-read will help. I'll keep you posted. You guys are the best!

 

Did you find that it helped? I got the book but never finished reading it. :blush:

 

So, I've decided to contact a child psychologist we were referred to. I'm just at a loss with what to do, particularly with William. I just want a happy house. I'm tired of all the anger and crying and tantrums...my from FIVE year olds. Ironcially, the 2 year old is generally OK!

 

I highly recommend martial arts. We recently saw my brother and nephew, who has had a some behavior problems over the years. He's now in karate and LOVES it. My brother says that his behavior has improved tremendously. But I warn you that it isn't cheap.

 

This was going to be my suggestion .. we're in the process of this ourselves. I just didn't know what else to do .. especially when this behaviour was affecting his schooling.

Lucky for me .. it's just Jayden. Jesse is a sweetheart.

Good luck !

 

I was thinking about this, too, but I'm confused with all the different types of martial arts out there. I'm not sure which one is the best for them.

 

The martial arts that Gabe started last Fall is calle Choi Kwang Do. There were 2 reasons we chose this one. The first is b/c DH studied it when he was younger. The 2nd is b/c it is not a combat martial arts. Here's a link to a website.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choi_Kwang-Do

http://www.choikwangdo.com/

I think that you will see the benefits from any martial arts though that will include self discipline, patience, tolerance, confidence, health, etc.

I did go to a counselor for a bit to help us get through a really rough patch last Fall. I would make sure to seek one experienced with children.

 

What works for me is threatening to not let them use the computer or Wii, that curves their behavior almost instantly.